No Re-entry

[MSU01]

If teams were scoring more in the 3Q than any other quarter of the game, you'd have a point. But our box scores from the past 3 years say otherwise.

2024: https://msubobcats.com/sports/football/schedule/2024
2023: https://msubobcats.com/sports/football/schedule/2023
2022: https://msubobcats.com/sports/football/schedule/2022

Most of the scoring incidences happen either in blowouts, or after MSU had already scored in the 3Q. It does not matter, now let us drink and socialize in peace.

Long live re-entry

Agreed, and I say this as a fan who never leaves the stadium from kickoff until the final whistle no matter how lopsided the score. It simply doesn't matter. Enjoy the game how you want and mind your own business about how others enjoy it. What's next, fan police roving through the crowd chastising fans who don't make noise on defensive third downs or clap along with the fight song after a touchdown?

You ignore all of the visiting coaches saying it makes a difference. Eck laid it out. Why do the visiting teams want to be in the South end to start the second half? This has been the same story for years. I don't see anybody changing what they are doing, but the opposing coaches have been saying the same thing for years.

And if you look at the actual game results over the years, they don't show a pattern of opposing teams faring any better at the start of the third quarter than they do at other times during the game. Any advantage gained by the MSU team from having the stadium 100% full instead of 70% full is negligible and surely isn't worth the controversy that instituting a no re-entry policy would create, nor would such a policy ensure that all fans would be in their seats at all points during the game. Instead of going out to the tailgate and missing the first 5 minutes of the third quarter, you could stand in a 15 minute bathroom line followed by a 20 minute line at the concession stand and miss even more of the game!

[kmax]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

[49thparallel]

Although I don't agree with a "no entry" policy, don't kid yourself that it doesn't make a difference to the team as mentioned by Vigen @ IDSU and by Eck at his presser. I'm not in favor of restricting freedom of choice if someone wants to spend more time at a tailgate or if extenuating circumstances prevent them from getting back in time for the second half kick off. Better to have more fans in seats cheering, even if late, than empty seats and no fans at all.

[ilovethecats]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

[D-Wreck]

I heard an unsubstantiated rumor that Coach Eck won't be on the sidelines for this game.

He read this thread and broke three ribs laughing at how ridiculous all this in fighting is. He planted the seed and y'all grew it into a sequoia.

[Cataholic]

We still get to play 11 players on D in the 3rd right?

So you’re saying that players don’t feed off of energy from the crowd?
What do you think creates a home field advantage in the first place?
Smaller crowd could mean less energy to feed off of for the players and could make the difference in the outcome of a drive which could affect the outcome of the game.

Oh they definitely do, even if the stadium is half full for the first Idaho drive, that’s 11k. Anyone who was at the Furman playoff game knows that’s enough to carry the torch while our peers finish their beverage.

So now 11,000 is just as good as 22,000? Got it!

[Cataholic]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

Wrong. No team without re-entry has half the stadium out of their seats. That is just flat out not accurate. And most of the time at MSU, it is more than half is still gone. I bet there have been instances where we have around 7,000 at kickoff.

[wbtfg]

We still get to play 11 players on D in the 3rd right?

So you’re saying that players don’t feed off of energy from the crowd?
What do you think creates a home field advantage in the first place?
Smaller crowd could mean less energy to feed off of for the players and could make the difference in the outcome of a drive which could affect the outcome of the game.

Oh they definitely do, even if the stadium is half full for the first Idaho drive, that’s 11k. Anyone who was at the Furman playoff game knows that’s enough to carry the torch while our peers finish their beverage.

So now 11,000 is just as good as 22,000? Got it!

I think we should also have hall monitors checking people’s passes when they use the restrooms or buy something from concession. We should also issue tardy slips to fans who aren’t in their seats at the for the team runout.

Also, if you have to miss a game, fans would need to call ahead of time to be excused.

[kmax]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

We're talking about two different things here. You are focused on the original thought around butts in seats=loud=advantage/disadvantage. Fine argue that all you want, some good circumstantial evidence both ways. But whenever this topic gets brought up people get fired up about things like how they have paid for a tailgate, travelled, paid other costs (which I get, these weekends are f*cking expensive!) and that they can go to their tailgate if they want. All I'm saying is that it's funny people at MSU get so caught up in this. 99% of other venues don't allow it and people still go, spend all the money and I don't think I've heard many (if any) complain that they couldn't go out and have a beer outside whenever they want. It is a right here, at least it has been and is currently, but many seem to think if they change the rules that it is the end of MSU football or that they will have done some horrible wrong to the fans, but that just isn't true.

[ClowderUp]

6-0 start has warped the normal troll-y stuff into this bizarre thread. Speaking of which, I think somebody needs to conduct a wellness check on Otis.

[ilovethecats]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

Wrong. No team without re-entry has half the stadium out of their seats. That is just flat out not accurate. And most of the time at MSU, it is more than half is still gone. I bet there have been instances where we have around 7,000 at kickoff.

Well I guess I'd need some sort of data to back up that claim. I don't think I've ever seen that few people in the stands to start the 3rd quarter. But obviously I don't have the numbers to back that up either. But has never seemed that empty to me.

And I most definitely seen much bigger stadiums than ours looking just like ours at the start of the 3rd. People leave their seats at halftime for many reasons. But no, I never claimed when I went to a Michigan game the stands were half full in the 3rd. That would be ridiculous. But it was definitely way less full than the start of the game, as in the case with many games I've been too, including pro games.

But you are correct if your stance is that our stadium is anywhere from 30-50% full in the 3rd, that isn't the case in other places. I just don't think it's the case here either. And certainly won't be Saturday night.

[Cataholic]

If teams were scoring more in the 3Q than any other quarter of the game, you'd have a point. But our box scores from the past 3 years say otherwise.

2024: https://msubobcats.com/sports/football/schedule/2024
2023: https://msubobcats.com/sports/football/schedule/2023
2022: https://msubobcats.com/sports/football/schedule/2022

Most of the scoring incidences happen either in blowouts, or after MSU had already scored in the 3Q. It does not matter, now let us drink and socialize in peace.

Long live re-entry

Agreed, and I say this as a fan who never leaves the stadium from kickoff until the final whistle no matter how lopsided the score. It simply doesn't matter. Enjoy the game how you want and mind your own business about how others enjoy it. What's next, fan police roving through the crowd chastising fans who don't make noise on defensive third downs or clap along with the fight song after a touchdown?

I guess Eck and Vigen have no idea what they are talking about. You should reach out to them and let them know.

Here's the result of the opening drive of the second half for all MSU home games since 2021:

2021 vs Drake: Drake Punt
2021 vs San Diego: MSU TD
2021 vs UNC: UNC Punt
2021 vs Poly: MSU missed FG
2021 vs ISU: ISU FG
2021 vs Idaho: MSU turnover on downs
2021 vs UTM: MSU FG
2021 vs SDSU: SDSU Punt

2022 vs McNeese: MSU FG
2022 vs Morehead: Morehead Punt
2022 vs UCD: MSU Punt
2022 vs ISU: MSU Punt
2022 vs Weber: Weber safety on bad punt snap
2022 vs UM: UM Punt
2022 vs Weber: MSU FG
2022 vs W&M: MSU TD

2023 vs Utah Tech: UTU Punt
2023 vs Stetson: MSU Fumble
2023 vs PSU: PSU Punt
2023 vs Poly: Poly missed FG
2023 vs NAU: NAU Punt
2023 vs EWU: MSU TD
2023 vs NDSU: NDSU TD

2024 vs Maine: MSU Fumble
2024 vs Mercyhurst: Mercyhurst Punt
2024 vs UNC: MSU Punt

26 home games, 13 of those drives MSU had the ball, and the 13 opponent drives have resulted in 10 punts, 1 missed FG, and 2 scoring drives for 10 total points. 0.38 points per game. Vigen and Eck can do their jobs without me contacting them but game results don't suggest it matters.

This is comical. You have both Eck and Vigen on record talking about the impact. Yet you somehow feel more knowledgeable than them. Other coaches have stated the same thing. It actually affects whether teams defer or accept at the beginning of the game.

While having half the stadium gone clearly makes it easier for an opponent to operate, it does not take away the fact that our team is flat out good. We should be successful all the time. But to try and defend that 11,000 fans is just as effective as 22,000 fans is stupid. And to not forego a 10 minute social break to provide the BEST environment for your team is mind boggling to me.

[ilovethecats]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

We're talking about two different things here. You are focused on the original thought around butts in seats=loud=advantage/disadvantage. Fine argue that all you want, some good circumstantial evidence both ways. But whenever this topic gets brought up people get fired up about things like how they have paid for a tailgate, travelled, paid other costs (which I get, these weekends are f*cking expensive!) and that they can go to their tailgate if they want. All I'm saying is that it's funny people at MSU get so caught up in this. 99% of other venues don't allow it and people still go, spend all the money and I don't think I've heard many (if any) complain that they couldn't go out and have a beer outside whenever they want. It is a right here, at least it has been and is currently, but many seem to think if they change the rules that it is the end of MSU football or that they will have done some horrible wrong to the fans, but that just isn't true.

You're right it is two different things but I think they factor together. Right now it IS a right for people to tailgate at halftime because the rules permit it. Other fans don't have to like it, but it is still a right. And those using factors like travelling, paying for tailgates and the overall expensiveness of games are still within their current rights as the rules stand. They are free to enjoy the game however they like within the rules whether other fans like it or not.

However, if MSU decides to implement a no re-entry, those same fans can decide if they want to continue going to the games. If all the extra stuff is a big factor for them, they are more than within their own rights to no longer go. I don't think that would be the case for many. We'd probably hear a lot of griping, but I'd suspect the majority would still decide to attend games. And I'd hope that if they didn't, we'd have people waiting in the wings to take those spots. But if they didn't, and we lost season ticket holders and attendance went down, I wonder if people would rather have that, or have our current situation with a great fanbase, albeit some getting back to their seats a little later in the 3rd.

As I said, I just don't think this is an issue. I'll be in my seats in 104 and I'll promise to scream a little louder to make up for the fans still coming in. Most of who are not as loud as me anyway......

[tetoncat]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

I don't take the comments as saying any one is a bad fan. More so that you can tailgate before and after so why not stay in. I understand the reasons people do it and there are things that I believe need addressed in the stadium before a re entry policy could happen. I also think during playoff games there isn't as many that leave and don't get back in. Much fewer social fans for those games and less chance it is the game a group always gets together so maximize that time. Blowout games 2nd half never gets as full as start of game.

[Cataholic]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

Wrong. No team without re-entry has half the stadium out of their seats. That is just flat out not accurate. And most of the time at MSU, it is more than half is still gone. I bet there have been instances where we have around 7,000 at kickoff.

Well I guess I'd need some sort of data to back up that claim. I don't think I've ever seen that few people in the stands to start the 3rd quarter. But obviously I don't have the numbers to back that up either. But has never seemed that empty to me.

And I most definitely seen much bigger stadiums than ours looking just like ours at the start of the 3rd. People leave their seats at halftime for many reasons. But no, I never claimed when I went to a Michigan game the stands were half full in the 3rd. That would be ridiculous. But it was definitely way less full than the start of the game, as in the case with many games I've been too, including pro games.

But you are correct if your stance is that our stadium is anywhere from 30-50% full in the 3rd, that isn't the case in other places. I just don't think it's the case here either. And certainly won't be Saturday night.

Just from a physical standpoint, it is impossible in most stadiums to have half the crowd wandering the stadium at any time. Now if your total game attendances is 7,000 total, that is a little different since half the stadium was empty when everyone was seated.

I always try to be in my seat before the 3rd quarter kickoff. Hopefully it won’t be too bad this game, but I have seen some crowds that would be mistaken for a Northern Colorado home game. Watch the rest of the season and see what you think.

[Bocephus]

Eck really opened up a can worms here!

[Cataholic]

As others have said this isn't something that people are going to agree on here. I get it, it's the way we do. What I do find funny is that people act like this is a god given right. I have been to a lot of sporting events across college and pro sports at a lot of different venues in my life. I can literally count on one hand (and still have fingers left over) the number that allow people to leave and re-enter the venue. Like I said, I get it it is what has always been done here but to act like keeping people in the stadium all game is this crazy thing or that you should have a right to do this has always been comical to me.

But the thing is kmax it IS how it's always been done and until the rules change it IS a right. If they change the rules then it will no longer be a right. Just like every other rule they have implemented in the stadium. As of this moment fans are allowed to leave and come back in, and I don't think it makes them a bad fan for doing so.

I guess my main point on this is unless they enforce some crazy rule that you're never allowed to leave your seat, things will always be this way. If it's not out in the tailgates, it will be in the concourses. Fans will still leave at halftime to get concessions, warm up, use the bathroom, and visit with friends. Lines will still be long, fans will still visit with friends, and people will always be late getting back to their seats. I've been to many games throughout the country, I think all of which didn't allow re-entry. But the 3rd quarter still looked the same in the stands because people were still leaving their seats. I just think people make a bigger deal of this than what it is.

We're talking about two different things here. You are focused on the original thought around butts in seats=loud=advantage/disadvantage. Fine argue that all you want, some good circumstantial evidence both ways. But whenever this topic gets brought up people get fired up about things like how they have paid for a tailgate, travelled, paid other costs (which I get, these weekends are f*cking expensive!) and that they can go to their tailgate if they want. All I'm saying is that it's funny people at MSU get so caught up in this. 99% of other venues don't allow it and people still go, spend all the money and I don't think I've heard many (if any) complain that they couldn't go out and have a beer outside whenever they want. It is a right here, at least it has been and is currently, but many seem to think if they change the rules that it is the end of MSU football or that they will have done some horrible wrong to the fans, but that just isn't true.

Well said. Having been to many other facilities, it has never struck me as lacking if they did not allow re-entry. It is normal standard. And if they sold beer in the stadium (which most facilities now do), I had even less reason to take notice.

[Bobcatsinmso]

Those darn pesky Bobcats, it is all their fault. We need to make a new rule that the Cats can only be ahead by three points or less, and better yet tied up or behind at halftime for every home game! By golly then you will see at least 75% of the fans back in their seats at the 2nd half kickoff.

[ilovethecats]

I also think during playoff games there isn't as many that leave and don't get back in. Much fewer social fans for those games and less chance it is the game a group always gets together so maximize that time. Blowout games 2nd half never gets as full as start of game.

This is another big reason I don't think this should be an issue. We have fans of all kinds. Some always sit. Some rarely scream but instead just enjoy the game. we have many fans who aren't there to be loud at all. We have many very casual fans, which is ok. So if it is these people that are late getting back, do we really lose that much? The die hards, the ones that love being loud, I'd guess are most of the ones already in their seats after half. I don't think we lose a whole lot in terms of energy and noise by people being a little late back to their seats. And it never seems to be much of an issue in the bigger games that matter, regardless of attendance. The playoff games with far lower in attendance seems to paint that picture. It's not the quantity of the fans in my mind, but rather the quality of the fans that matter most.

[Bobcatsinmso]

I also think during playoff games there isn't as many that leave and don't get back in. Much fewer social fans for those games and less chance it is the game a group always gets together so maximize that time. Blowout games 2nd half never gets as full as start of game.

This is another big reason I don't think this should be an issue. We have fans of all kinds. Some always sit. Some rarely scream but instead just enjoy the game. we have many fans who aren't there to be loud at all. We have many very casual fans, which is ok. So if it is these people that are late getting back, do we really lose that much? The die hards, the ones that love being loud, I'd guess are most of the ones already in their seats after half. I don't think we lose a whole lot in terms of energy and noise by people being a little late back to their seats. And it never seems to be much of an issue in the bigger games that matter, regardless of attendance. The playoff games with far lower in attendance seems to paint that picture. It's not the quantity of the fans in my mind, but rather the quality of the fans that matter most.

Truth.