Moving up

[BleedingBLue]

Long time lurker. This topic finally convinced me to make an account.

For context I grew up in NW Montana in a family of casual Griz fans, but I was always more of a Cat fan and that was solidified when I pursued my degree in engineering from MSU (graduated 2017).

Due to current life circumstances I can’t quite swing season tickets, but I have attended about 3 regular season and all post season football games since graduating.

I am finding it really hard to spend the money to take my family to this year’s slate of home games. Gold Rush has its own energy and NAU and EWU might be ok. The game day experience is good, but it’s going to be hard to keep the crowd engaged and coming back if it’s just 6 blowouts. I know that I would be looking forward to this season a lot more if I saw Wyoming, Boise State, USU, etc on the schedule.

People on this board dog on the NDSU fans for not selling out their barn during the season, however that is exactly where we are headed if we stay at in this conference and at this level.

Would you feel the same if the blowouts were going to be the other way around? If we were expected to get shallacked in 3 of 6 home games you would be more willing to get season tickets than if we were expected to do the shallacking?

The main thing to note is that Boise, Fresno, USU fans etc would view us as the PSU, UNC, ISU of the MWC. There is no reason they want MSU in the conference.

You’re under the assumption that the talent level of the team wouldn’t rise with a move to MWC. Additionally, fans from visiting teams would travel to catch a game. It’s Bozeman for crying out loud. Unlike half the teams in the BSC who barely have a fan base at all.

You're right, I am under that assumption. FCS to FBS transitions have been successful on just a few occasions. As Nevada Reno, Georgia Southern, Marshall and so on and so forth. And it would be angood thing that visiting teams fill our stadium?

Actually, there has been some recent success stories: Coastal Carolina, Liberty, App State and James Madison to name a few. I think we compare well with those schools.

Like I said, on a few occasions.

[BleedingBLue]

Long time lurker. This topic finally convinced me to make an account.

For context I grew up in NW Montana in a family of casual Griz fans, but I was always more of a Cat fan and that was solidified when I pursued my degree in engineering from MSU (graduated 2017).

Due to current life circumstances I can’t quite swing season tickets, but I have attended about 3 regular season and all post season football games since graduating.

I am finding it really hard to spend the money to take my family to this year’s slate of home games. Gold Rush has its own energy and NAU and EWU might be ok. The game day experience is good, but it’s going to be hard to keep the crowd engaged and coming back if it’s just 6 blowouts. I know that I would be looking forward to this season a lot more if I saw Wyoming, Boise State, USU, etc on the schedule.

People on this board dog on the NDSU fans for not selling out their barn during the season, however that is exactly where we are headed if we stay at in this conference and at this level.

Would you feel the same if the blowouts were going to be the other way around? If we were expected to get shallacked in 3 of 6 home games you would be more willing to get season tickets than if we were expected to do the shallacking?

The main thing to note is that Boise, Fresno, USU fans etc would view us as the PSU, UNC, ISU of the MWC. There is no reason they want MSU in the conference.

You’re under the assumption that the talent level of the team wouldn’t rise with a move to MWC. Additionally, fans from visiting teams would travel to catch a game. It’s Bozeman for crying out loud. Unlike half the teams in the BSC who barely have a fan base at all.

You're right, I am under that assumption. FCS to FBS transitions have been successful on just a few occasions. As Nevada Reno, Georgia Southern, Marshall and so on and so forth. And it would be angood thing that visiting teams fill our stadium?

In your perceived future, the FCS and FBS are identical to what they are right now, and that simply won’t be the case. I truly believe it’s going to look like what Colter envisions. And if the Cats stick around, they might be winning the “national championship” in a third rate FCS shadow against Western Illinois while the Dakota Schools are playing in a competitive playoff in the new G5 division.

If, and I think it's a big if, it does look different than the current setup, then I'm all for moving up. But who's going to make the change? The NCAA certainly isn't. They don't want 2 or 3 super conferences to break off and form their own collegiate division. And unless that happens there won't be a division between them and the FCS. The new playoff system doesn't start Intel 2024. I think it will be given at least 5 years to see how it works before another major change happens, so the moving up point is moot for now in my opinion.

[CalgaryCat]

Long time lurker. This topic finally convinced me to make an account.

For context I grew up in NW Montana in a family of casual Griz fans, but I was always more of a Cat fan and that was solidified when I pursued my degree in engineering from MSU (graduated 2017).

Due to current life circumstances I can’t quite swing season tickets, but I have attended about 3 regular season and all post season football games since graduating.

I am finding it really hard to spend the money to take my family to this year’s slate of home games. Gold Rush has its own energy and NAU and EWU might be ok. The game day experience is good, but it’s going to be hard to keep the crowd engaged and coming back if it’s just 6 blowouts. I know that I would be looking forward to this season a lot more if I saw Wyoming, Boise State, USU, etc on the schedule.

People on this board dog on the NDSU fans for not selling out their barn during the season, however that is exactly where we are headed if we stay at in this conference and at this level.

Would you feel the same if the blowouts were going to be the other way around? If we were expected to get shallacked in 3 of 6 home games you would be more willing to get season tickets than if we were expected to do the shallacking?

The main thing to note is that Boise, Fresno, USU fans etc would view us as the PSU, UNC, ISU of the MWC. There is no reason they want MSU in the conference.

You’re under the assumption that the talent level of the team wouldn’t rise with a move to MWC. Additionally, fans from visiting teams would travel to catch a game. It’s Bozeman for crying out loud. Unlike half the teams in the BSC who barely have a fan base at all.

You're right, I am under that assumption. FCS to FBS transitions have been successful on just a few occasions. As Nevada Reno, Georgia Southern, Marshall and so on and so forth. And it would be angood thing that visiting teams fill our stadium?

In your perceived future, the FCS and FBS are identical to what they are right now, and that simply won’t be the case. I truly believe it’s going to look like what Colter envisions. And if the Cats stick around, they might be winning the “national championship” in a third rate FCS shadow against Western Illinois while the Dakota Schools are playing in a competitive playoff in the new G5 division.

If, and I think it's a big if, it does look different than the current setup, then I'm all for moving up. But who's going to make the change? The NCAA certainly isn't. They don't want 2 or 3 super conferences to break off and form their own collegiate division. And unless that happens there won't be a division between them and the FCS. The new playoff system doesn't start Intel 2024. I think it will be given at least 5 years to see how it works before another major change happens, so the moving up point is moot for now in my opinion.

The NCAA has lost control of college football, I really don’t think they’ll have much power to stop the ~50 biggest programs from splitting off

[tetoncat]

For those saying people who don't want season tickets if we move up are fair weather fans, why? Even the most devoted fans get tired of mediocre or worse teams eventually.

As a fan I want a team that is playing for something every year. If we move up that won't be the case. Playing for a decent bowl game isn't playing for something. Even when the Cats were not good in the 90s there was always hope to start the year. 2000s, hope to start the year. There has been hope for 30 years and that fuels fandom. If MSU is an FBS team what hope is there for the end of the season? Unless you love a bowl game, there isn't any.

I'm the biggest hater on bowls you will find. I can say with full confidence I have never watched a bowl game played before New Years Day in my entire life. I used to refuse to talk about bowl season on the radio other than to just hate on it when I had a daily co-host. Now we don't talk about it at all.

But college football has been defined as a money-making machine. The only way to maintain a business is to add new revenue streams. There's only one way to do that: move up.

Let me ask you this: if the future in 15 years is Montana State still playing in the FCS and absolutely dominating the subdivision, going undefeated every single year, winning the Big Sky and making runs at national championships....and the competition is Utah Tech and Azusa Pacific and Western Illinois....and Eastern Washington and Portland State are playing D-II and every other reputable FCS program has moved on....is that better than moving up to the FBS and trying to win 10 games and go to the Holiday Bowl or whatever?

One thing Danny Sprinkle taught me during our four years working together: in the current state of affairs in Division I college sports, you can bitch and moan and complain and resist the trends and changes of the day. Or you can accept them, find your advantages and roll. You think Sprinkle wanted to be he most transfer-heavy program in the league? Nope, but they hung two banners. And he was such a figure head, players like RaeQuan Battle and Jubrile Belo quickly lost the fan perception as transfers and were thought of as simply Bobcats.

You move up to the Mountain West or have the ability to pay coaches more competitively, you don't lose Sprinkle.

The future in my opinion is that the Power 5 will break off completely and have a completely separate governing body. IF and when that happens in basketball, Division I sports will be at a crossroads. The NCAA DOES NOT run the College Football Playoff, therefore does not benefit financially from college football. If that same thing happened to men's Division I basketball, all NCAA Tournament revenue would cease.

Then what will happen to all the Title XI sports that exist to off-set football scholarships? No NCAA Tournament would basically mean the elimination or the complete reconfiguration of every non-revenue college sport in the country.

Once the entire thing fractures — and it's coming, make no mistake; UCLA, USC, Washington and Oregon will not be left out to dry to get the billions in TV money that's going to come the way of the SEC and the Big Ten. Then once they bounce from the Pac 12, what happens? Utah, Arizona, Arizona State and Colorado will find a way to align and get into the Big XII. Then what's next for Oregon State and Washington State? Everything will fracture, the Power 5 will realign into a Power 3 or a Power 4, each will get network TV deals and everyone else will be left to pick up the pieces and figure it all out.

So when that theoretical Power 4 exists and they stop playing FCS and Group of 5 teams for money games, how is that revenue replaced? Half the Big Sky couldn't have football if they didn't get their asses kicked twice a year by FBS schools.

The best case scenario once the fracture happens is that all the teams out West that don't get into the Network TV conglomeration team up with each other, get their own TV deal and form a new level of Division I football that maybe even includes a playoff.

I just don't see it going any other way. You have to evolve or die. That's just the way it is when you determine that the No. 1 determining factor in your capitalist society is the almighty dollar.

I know a lot of you think this is depressing. I'm totally with you. I have very little joy covering college sports anymore. It's a complete disaster to me. I only propose all these ideas and scenarios because the only way Montana State and Montana avoid falling further into irrelevancy is to get out of a two-bit league that legislates to the lowest common denominator.

You can hate that all you want. I don't like it. But it is the reality of the situation.

You lost me a little.

"The best case scenario once the fracture happens is that all the teams out West that don't get into the Network TV conglomeration team up with each other, get their own TV deal and form a new level of Division I football that maybe even includes a playoff."

So best case is we move up, wait for the bigger conferences to break away, then stay in the new second tier. Isn't that what we are already in. If that happens I think MSU will have the chance to get into another conference at that time or stay and be part of the 3rd tier.

You also reference basketball and NCAA tourney. If that stops and those same 50 or 60 schools that breakaway in football also do in basketball Eben in the MWC we are not part of the big kid table.

[GoldstoneCat]

For those saying people who don't want season tickets if we move up are fair weather fans, why? Even the most devoted fans get tired of mediocre or worse teams eventually.

As a fan I want a team that is playing for something every year. If we move up that won't be the case. Playing for a decent bowl game isn't playing for something. Even when the Cats were not good in the 90s there was always hope to start the year. 2000s, hope to start the year. There has been hope for 30 years and that fuels fandom. If MSU is an FBS team what hope is there for the end of the season? Unless you love a bowl game, there isn't any.

I'm the biggest hater on bowls you will find. I can say with full confidence I have never watched a bowl game played before New Years Day in my entire life. I used to refuse to talk about bowl season on the radio other than to just hate on it when I had a daily co-host. Now we don't talk about it at all.

But college football has been defined as a money-making machine. The only way to maintain a business is to add new revenue streams. There's only one way to do that: move up.

Let me ask you this: if the future in 15 years is Montana State still playing in the FCS and absolutely dominating the subdivision, going undefeated every single year, winning the Big Sky and making runs at national championships....and the competition is Utah Tech and Azusa Pacific and Western Illinois....and Eastern Washington and Portland State are playing D-II and every other reputable FCS program has moved on....is that better than moving up to the FBS and trying to win 10 games and go to the Holiday Bowl or whatever?

One thing Danny Sprinkle taught me during our four years working together: in the current state of affairs in Division I college sports, you can bitch and moan and complain and resist the trends and changes of the day. Or you can accept them, find your advantages and roll. You think Sprinkle wanted to be he most transfer-heavy program in the league? Nope, but they hung two banners. And he was such a figure head, players like RaeQuan Battle and Jubrile Belo quickly lost the fan perception as transfers and were thought of as simply Bobcats.

You move up to the Mountain West or have the ability to pay coaches more competitively, you don't lose Sprinkle.

The future in my opinion is that the Power 5 will break off completely and have a completely separate governing body. IF and when that happens in basketball, Division I sports will be at a crossroads. The NCAA DOES NOT run the College Football Playoff, therefore does not benefit financially from college football. If that same thing happened to men's Division I basketball, all NCAA Tournament revenue would cease.

Then what will happen to all the Title XI sports that exist to off-set football scholarships? No NCAA Tournament would basically mean the elimination or the complete reconfiguration of every non-revenue college sport in the country.

Once the entire thing fractures — and it's coming, make no mistake; UCLA, USC, Washington and Oregon will not be left out to dry to get the billions in TV money that's going to come the way of the SEC and the Big Ten. Then once they bounce from the Pac 12, what happens? Utah, Arizona, Arizona State and Colorado will find a way to align and get into the Big XII. Then what's next for Oregon State and Washington State? Everything will fracture, the Power 5 will realign into a Power 3 or a Power 4, each will get network TV deals and everyone else will be left to pick up the pieces and figure it all out.

So when that theoretical Power 4 exists and they stop playing FCS and Group of 5 teams for money games, how is that revenue replaced? Half the Big Sky couldn't have football if they didn't get their asses kicked twice a year by FBS schools.

The best case scenario once the fracture happens is that all the teams out West that don't get into the Network TV conglomeration team up with each other, get their own TV deal and form a new level of Division I football that maybe even includes a playoff.

I just don't see it going any other way. You have to evolve or die. That's just the way it is when you determine that the No. 1 determining factor in your capitalist society is the almighty dollar.

I know a lot of you think this is depressing. I'm totally with you. I have very little joy covering college sports anymore. It's a complete disaster to me. I only propose all these ideas and scenarios because the only way Montana State and Montana avoid falling further into irrelevancy is to get out of a two-bit league that legislates to the lowest common denominator.

You can hate that all you want. I don't like it. But it is the reality of the situation.

You lost me a little.

"The best case scenario once the fracture happens is that all the teams out West that don't get into the Network TV conglomeration team up with each other, get their own TV deal and form a new level of Division I football that maybe even includes a playoff."

So best case is we move up, wait for the bigger conferences to break away, then stay in the new second tier. Isn't that what we are already in. If that happens I think MSU will have the chance to get into another conference at that time or stay and be part of the 3rd tier.

You also reference basketball and NCAA tourney. If that stops and those same 50 or 60 schools that breakaway in football also do in basketball Eben in the MWC we are not part of the big kid table.

You're right, we're not likely to ever be at the largest table, but if we position properly we will maintain contact with our peer institutions in the west, Texas etc. We need to be with the Dakota states, the Wyomings, CSU, even Utah state type schools. If you don't take that leap when it's offered you may not get another. The big questions i have about external factors, notwithstanding our own budgetary shortfall re:MWC, are whether UM would have to go when we go (i believe yes) and whether they're even as close to ready as we would be (i think not). So many moving pieces, but I am sure we'll be looking if things out west start to move quickly. Let's face it, those mid tier MWC schools have a better footprint in the west than we do. Interesting times.

[CelticCat]

MWC member Fresno State proposed stadium upgrades:

[Cat Grad]

MWC member Fresno State proposed stadium upgrades:

Nice. As long as MSU isn't on the short end of the scoreboard for the first game and it remains Jim Sweeney Field at Bulldog Stadium, I'm fine with it. Of course, I doubt if they care what I think.

http://stadiumdb.com/stadiums/usa/bulldog_stadium

Thought this is relevant also:

https://www.fresnobee.com/sports/colleg ... 96221.html

[coloradocat]

MWC member Fresno State proposed stadium upgrades:

Fill in the endzone with seats and I love it.

[Cat Grad]

MWC member Fresno State proposed stadium upgrades:

Really kind of funny reading the comments, especially the egomaniacs from boise...

[tetoncat]

For those saying people who don't want season tickets if we move up are fair weather fans, why? Even the most devoted fans get tired of mediocre or worse teams eventually.

As a fan I want a team that is playing for something every year. If we move up that won't be the case. Playing for a decent bowl game isn't playing for something. Even when the Cats were not good in the 90s there was always hope to start the year. 2000s, hope to start the year. There has been hope for 30 years and that fuels fandom. If MSU is an FBS team what hope is there for the end of the season? Unless you love a bowl game, there isn't any.

I'm the biggest hater on bowls you will find. I can say with full confidence I have never watched a bowl game played before New Years Day in my entire life. I used to refuse to talk about bowl season on the radio other than to just hate on it when I had a daily co-host. Now we don't talk about it at all.

But college football has been defined as a money-making machine. The only way to maintain a business is to add new revenue streams. There's only one way to do that: move up.

Let me ask you this: if the future in 15 years is Montana State still playing in the FCS and absolutely dominating the subdivision, going undefeated every single year, winning the Big Sky and making runs at national championships....and the competition is Utah Tech and Azusa Pacific and Western Illinois....and Eastern Washington and Portland State are playing D-II and every other reputable FCS program has moved on....is that better than moving up to the FBS and trying to win 10 games and go to the Holiday Bowl or whatever?

One thing Danny Sprinkle taught me during our four years working together: in the current state of affairs in Division I college sports, you can bitch and moan and complain and resist the trends and changes of the day. Or you can accept them, find your advantages and roll. You think Sprinkle wanted to be he most transfer-heavy program in the league? Nope, but they hung two banners. And he was such a figure head, players like RaeQuan Battle and Jubrile Belo quickly lost the fan perception as transfers and were thought of as simply Bobcats.

You move up to the Mountain West or have the ability to pay coaches more competitively, you don't lose Sprinkle.

The future in my opinion is that the Power 5 will break off completely and have a completely separate governing body. IF and when that happens in basketball, Division I sports will be at a crossroads. The NCAA DOES NOT run the College Football Playoff, therefore does not benefit financially from college football. If that same thing happened to men's Division I basketball, all NCAA Tournament revenue would cease.

Then what will happen to all the Title XI sports that exist to off-set football scholarships? No NCAA Tournament would basically mean the elimination or the complete reconfiguration of every non-revenue college sport in the country.

Once the entire thing fractures — and it's coming, make no mistake; UCLA, USC, Washington and Oregon will not be left out to dry to get the billions in TV money that's going to come the way of the SEC and the Big Ten. Then once they bounce from the Pac 12, what happens? Utah, Arizona, Arizona State and Colorado will find a way to align and get into the Big XII. Then what's next for Oregon State and Washington State? Everything will fracture, the Power 5 will realign into a Power 3 or a Power 4, each will get network TV deals and everyone else will be left to pick up the pieces and figure it all out.

So when that theoretical Power 4 exists and they stop playing FCS and Group of 5 teams for money games, how is that revenue replaced? Half the Big Sky couldn't have football if they didn't get their asses kicked twice a year by FBS schools.

The best case scenario once the fracture happens is that all the teams out West that don't get into the Network TV conglomeration team up with each other, get their own TV deal and form a new level of Division I football that maybe even includes a playoff.

I just don't see it going any other way. You have to evolve or die. That's just the way it is when you determine that the No. 1 determining factor in your capitalist society is the almighty dollar.

I know a lot of you think this is depressing. I'm totally with you. I have very little joy covering college sports anymore. It's a complete disaster to me. I only propose all these ideas and scenarios because the only way Montana State and Montana avoid falling further into irrelevancy is to get out of a two-bit league that legislates to the lowest common denominator.

You can hate that all you want. I don't like it. But it is the reality of the situation.

You lost me a little.

"The best case scenario once the fracture happens is that all the teams out West that don't get into the Network TV conglomeration team up with each other, get their own TV deal and form a new level of Division I football that maybe even includes a playoff."

So best case is we move up, wait for the bigger conferences to break away, then stay in the new second tier. Isn't that what we are already in. If that happens I think MSU will have the chance to get into another conference at that time or stay and be part of the 3rd tier.

You also reference basketball and NCAA tourney. If that stops and those same 50 or 60 schools that breakaway in football also do in basketball Eben in the MWC we are not part of the big kid table.

You're right, we're not likely to ever be at the largest table, but if we position properly we will maintain contact with our peer institutions in the west, Texas etc. We need to be with the Dakota states, the Wyomings, CSU, even Utah state type schools. If you don't take that leap when it's offered you may not get another. The big questions i have about external factors, notwithstanding our own budgetary shortfall re:MWC, are whether UM would have to go when we go (i believe yes) and whether they're even as close to ready as we would be (i think not). So many moving pieces, but I am sure we'll be looking if things out west start to move quickly. Let's face it, those mid tier MWC schools have a better footprint in the west than we do. Interesting times.

We currently have nationally ranked track members, final 4 FB, Conference champions MBB WBB, good volleyball , rodeo, club. Record enrollment, construction everywhere. What else are we looking for out of a conference footprint.

[PapaG]

The funding just isn’t there for moving to FBS and we have assistant coaches now housing together. Where does the money come from when we’re already putting 19,000 in the seats on Saturdays.

Maybe if MSU could not have failing enrollment Little Bro in Missoula attached it might be a possibility but the MWC doesn’t need us both as members. We’re a state of just over a million people. I moved back from a metro area of 2.5 million last year and it just doesn’t equate.

[CelticCat]

I've posted a lot of the data to this end, but I can try and sum it up here. I think MSU needs about $15 million more in revenue to be near the bottom of the MWC in revenue, the bare minimum. $40 million in revenue.

At least $5 million is pretty much already guaranteed due to TV contracts, bowl game payouts, march madness payouts. So the other $10 million needs to come from a combination of:

- institutional/state $ - Utah State gets $22m here for example, we get $10
- donor $ - we are at $5m, not sure what ceiling is here
- merchandising and sponsorship deals - we are extremely low here even by FCS/Big Sky standards, if the source I found is accurate
- competition guarantees - we get paid what roughly $500k-$700k for an FBS game (which we don't even do every year), that would turn into $1-$1.2 million for each OOC road game
- "other revenue"
The source has "other revenue" as - "Revenue from the following categories: Compensation and benefits provided by a third party; game program, novelty, parking and concession sales; sports camps and clinics; athletics restricted endowment and investments income; and, other operating revenue."

Don't get me wrong it's a big uphill battle and maybe the money just isn't there but when I dug into the numbers it isn't impossible. We'd be at $30 million in revenue just from added TV contracts and NCAA payouts. Utah State's revenue for example is $43 million.

And before anyone jumps at me for this, yes this goes without saying we need an invite into a MWC caliber conference, and no I don't want to go FBS just go to FBS, a big point of this is to be in a league with your peers, not some cobbled together FBS in name only conference like the WAC just tried to do (and failed).

[Cataholic]

The funding just isn’t there for moving to FBS and we have assistant coaches now housing together. Where does the money come from when we’re already putting 19,000 in the seats on Saturdays.

Maybe if MSU could not have failing enrollment Little Bro in Missoula attached it might be a possibility but the MWC doesn’t need us both as members. We’re a state of just over a million people. I moved back from a metro area of 2.5 million last year and it just doesn’t equate.

It has been mentioned multiple times that revenue could be generated in other areas - not just sports. With the wider footprint and larger exposure, an increase of just 500 students would generate $7.5 million in tuition at $15,000 per student.

[coloradocat]

The funding just isn’t there for moving to FBS and we have assistant coaches now housing together. Where does the money come from when we’re already putting 19,000 in the seats on Saturdays.

Maybe if MSU could not have failing enrollment Little Bro in Missoula attached it might be a possibility but the MWC doesn’t need us both as members. We’re a state of just over a million people. I moved back from a metro area of 2.5 million last year and it just doesn’t equate.

It has been mentioned multiple times that revenue could be generated in other areas - not just sports. With the wider footprint and larger exposure, an increase of just 500 students would generate $7.5 million in tuition at $15,000 per student.

And the university is just going to hand that over to Leon??

[PapaG]

The funding just isn’t there for moving to FBS and we have assistant coaches now housing together. Where does the money come from when we’re already putting 19,000 in the seats on Saturdays.

Maybe if MSU could not have failing enrollment Little Bro in Missoula attached it might be a possibility but the MWC doesn’t need us both as members. We’re a state of just over a million people. I moved back from a metro area of 2.5 million last year and it just doesn’t equate.

It has been mentioned multiple times that revenue could be generated in other areas - not just sports. With the wider footprint and larger exposure, an increase of just 500 students would generate $7.5 million in tuition at $15,000 per student.

Where does that revenue come from if not state taxpayers. We’re a nothing state only known for rich Flathead and Big Sky people along with a fictional TV show who are from their own universities that they donate toward. It’s kind of unbelievable what Waded has been able to do building my alma mater to what it is today. Financially moving up doesn’t make sense because our donor base is low and non-alumni in Bozeman have other allegiances to their own schools and grad schools.

[CelticCat]

FCS bolstering it’s ranks

[MSU01]

FCS bolstering it’s ranks

They don't have a football team. Still wouldn't be too surprised to see them on MSU's 2028 non-conference schedule.

[Montanabob]

FCS bolstering it’s ranks

They don't have a football team. Still wouldn't be too surprised to see them on MSU's 2028 non-conference schedule.

Undergraduate about 2500 students. Another 800 part time and graduate students.

[rivercat]

FCS bolstering it’s ranks

They don't have a football team. Still wouldn't be too surprised to see them on MSU's 2028 non-conference schedule.

Undergraduate about 2500 students. Another 800 part time and graduate students.

Peer academic institutions if we don't take an opportunity if and when it presents itself.

[CNC_Cat]

Long time lurker. This topic finally convinced me to make an account.

For context I grew up in NW Montana in a family of casual Griz fans, but I was always more of a Cat fan and that was solidified when I pursued my degree in engineering from MSU (graduated 2017).

Due to current life circumstances I can’t quite swing season tickets, but I have attended about 3 regular season and all post season football games since graduating.

I am finding it really hard to spend the money to take my family to this year’s slate of home games. Gold Rush has its own energy and NAU and EWU might be ok. The game day experience is good, but it’s going to be hard to keep the crowd engaged and coming back if it’s just 6 blowouts. I know that I would be looking forward to this season a lot more if I saw Wyoming, Boise State, USU, etc on the schedule.

People on this board dog on the NDSU fans for not selling out their barn during the season, however that is exactly where we are headed if we stay at in this conference and at this level.

Would you feel the same if the blowouts were going to be the other way around? If we were expected to get shallacked in 3 of 6 home games you would be more willing to get season tickets than if we were expected to do the shallacking?

The main thing to note is that Boise, Fresno, USU fans etc would view us as the PSU, UNC, ISU of the MWC. There is no reason they want MSU in the conference.

Well first of all, as others have stated, I truly believe that given the additional resources and exposure of a Mountain West school that MSU would be capable of fielding a team that would be competitive within a just a couple of years. I think that our most recent FBS games against Wyoming and even Oregon State demonstrate that we would not be totally out of our depth even with the current roster.

Second, regardless of whether the Cats win the game or not, as a sports fan I want to see top tier athletic performances. I want to be able to say that I was there when player X competed against the Bobcats in Bozeman Montana before going on to be an all-pro performer in the NFL. Right now, we aren't getting much of that.

Finally, would I feel the same if it was MSU getting blown out in our stadium half the time? I really don't know. Not having been a fan long enough to have experienced some of the more difficult times in MSU football history I really don't know what that is like. You are asking me if I would rather be downtrodden or bored with victory. Neither one is a good place to be. End of the day I guess I would rather cheer for a team and a school that is striving to claw their way forward and maximize their potential even if it means starting at the bottom of the food-chain in a bigger pond rather than one that is content to try to maintain place as big fish in the small pool. At least we could cheer for the team to get better.