Huse

[BLGCAT]

In all reality you can not complain about our basketball fan support, year in year out we are mediocore at best and still have double and triple the amount if not more people come and watch the games than PSU and. weber who are among the leagues best almost every year. If we were able to start coming in the top 2or 3 or maybe take the league I could see us averaging 5K fans a game, it just gets tiring watching mediocracy every year. And lastly as far as waits goes there were kids on my jv team in highscool that were more talented than him. Our recruiting needs improvement quick or we will finish 4th to 6th every year.

[BLGCAT]

I meant to say swita on my last post

[GrizinWashington]

I think you need to double check your facts. MSU doesn't average 2 to 3 times more attendance than Weber.

[BLGCAT]

I stand corrected, weber actually averages more in attendance than any big sky team and surprisingly more than many d1 schools such as boise st, Colorado st, Idaho, tcu, Houston and others.

[TomCat88]

I think you need to double check your facts. MSU doesn't average 2 to 3 times more attendance than Weber.

O' great master of all things factual, did you update your history file folder on Chambers?

[KittieKop]

I think WTG nailed it. I don't actually think you can compare our current situation in basketball to where we're at in football - two entirely different animals as far as support and intensity of support. That being said, I think it is much easier for people who have a deep (obsessive) interest in a sport/program to want to see that program succeed, and hold on to what may only be a sliver of hope. For me, sure I want a successful basketball program competing for a regular season and tournament title every year and heading to the NCAA tournament. But, I'm not shattered if they finish .500 and squeak into the tournament. I'm much more invested in the football program, therefore more impacted by losses in the program (that and the fact football only has 11 or 12 chances per year to feel that excitement of a great win or deep disappointment for losing one we shouldn't have - during basketball, we can relive that - what - 25 times?).

[whitetrashgriz]

In all reality you can not complain about our basketball fan support, year in year out we are mediocore at best and still have double and triple the amount if not more people come and watch the games than PSU and. weber who are among the leagues best almost every year. If we were able to start coming in the top 2or 3 or maybe take the league I could see us averaging 5K fans a game, it just gets tiring watching mediocracy every year. And lastly as far as waits goes there were kids on my jv team in highscool that were more talented than him. Our recruiting needs improvement quick or we will finish 4th to 6th every year.

we don't come close to doubling or tripling webers attendance. in fact many times we are below them. and psu is far from one of the best every year. they have one the last two tiurnies, but they had great talent. and these were the first that they have ever won. i'm in agreement that it's annoying that we have won one conference championship. that much is obvious. but we make the tourney regularly which is the only way you have a shot. again, this isn't me saying that i'm satisfied. but i think people think we are a worse program than everyone else in the league and that's not true. i mean, would the casual fan know that the griz have been the best hoops program in the last 20 years? most wouldn't. and people look at weber like a power-house but that's not true either. sure, in comparison to the cats i'd trade places with them in a minute. but they have only won 4 championships in the last 2 decades and only one every 4 or so years. i agree we need to take steps in getting better, and we have got to go to the dance soon 'cause it's getting ridiculous! but this league is always pretty even.

[TomCat88]

i mean, would the casual fan know that the griz have been the best hoops program in the last 20 years? most wouldn't. and people look at weber like a power-house but that's not true either. sure, in comparison to the cats i'd trade places with them in a minute. but they have only won 4 championships in the last 2 decades and only one every 4 or so years. i agree we need to take steps in getting better, and we have got to go to the dance soon 'cause it's getting ridiculous! but this league is always pretty even.

UM has been to the NCAA tourney 6 times and won the reg. season four times. They went to tourney four times despite not winning the reg. season crown. That's only been done three times by all other teams combined in that same time span. It's a good argument between U and WSU. WSU has 6 reg. season titles and four tourney trips. WSU also beat a couple heavy-hitters (No. Carolina and Mich. State both seeded around 3/4) and came within a whisker of getting to the Sweet 16 both times.

[whitetrashgriz]

i mean, would the casual fan know that the griz have been the best hoops program in the last 20 years? most wouldn't. and people look at weber like a power-house but that's not true either. sure, in comparison to the cats i'd trade places with them in a minute. but they have only won 4 championships in the last 2 decades and only one every 4 or so years. i agree we need to take steps in getting better, and we have got to go to the dance soon 'cause it's getting ridiculous! but this league is always pretty even.

UM has been to the NCAA tourney 6 times and won the reg. season four times. They went to tourney four times despite not winning the reg. season crown. That's only been done three times by all other teams combined in that same time span. It's a good argument between U and WSU. WSU has 6 reg. season titles and four tourney trips. WSU also beat a couple heavy-hitters (No. Carolina and Mich. State both seeded around 3/4) and came within a whisker of getting to the Sweet 16 both times.

sure, if you want to get all technical. i was just talking about tourney championships and bids into the big dance. people think weber because their teams were very, very good. but as far as dancing, no one has done that more than the griz. then weber, than teams like nau and psu got there twice. but for the most part, it's not as if we have one powerhouse that no one can compete with. we pretty much have a different champ every year or two. i'd just like to see the cats finish the deal more. years like '02 i believe when we hosted and lost to the griz. that was horrible, as well as the biggest choke i have ever witnessed in this league. other times we have made it to the title game only to lose. also very frustrating. but more seasons than not the cats are right in the mix. but for the immidiate future, i would hope we recruit a little bit better, and build a team capable of winning the close, hard-fought games because most of them in this conference are just that. but to suggest that any of us are happy, or even satisfied with losing is ridiculous. but i'm not gonna go stand on top of the field house with a magaphone screaming my displeasure. and what always get's lost in the shuffle is how these kids are doing in the classroom. apparnetly someone thought this idea was crazy because they brought up my statement previously that i'd accept a losing season if our roster was filled with kids who got great grades. isn't that how it should be? i understand this philosophy rarely flies in say the acc or sec. but this is big sky conference basketball guys. these kids are going to play a few years, and likely their playing days will be all but over. i wish these guys the best, and i alwasy prefer winning over losing, but that doesn't make me happy about losing. it's like saying that we accept losing when a big sky team loses in the opening round of the national tourney. it's not being satisfied...it's being realistic.

[TomCat88]

What I find surprising is that UM has only hosted the tourney once since 1992. The one time they did host it, they didn't make it. So all of their last four appearances came via winning the tourney in someone else's gym. I think they were the 6th seed when they won in Bozeman. Wonder what they seeded the other three times? I think they were the No. 3 seed the first year Krysko got them in and No. 2 the second time. No clue on the '97 team's seed.

[TomCat88]

Anyway back to Coach Huse. It's got to be eating him alive that he would be 10-4 and in second place had it not been for losing to (B)Eastern Washington twice -- a team that would only have one league win and five overall w/o MSU. "Oh! The humanity....!"

However, that's good coaching to get a team a road win just one night after a demoralizing loss. The pressure should be off now, because they pretty much can't finish anywhere but fourth. If they do and then they win the home game, they would almost certainly face WSU again in the semis.

[John K]

I would actually disagree with kittiekop's point of view. I think there are far too many people who consider Ash a great savior, even though his conference record is very comparable to Huse's. I think if asked most Cat fans who was doing a better job, more than 9 out of 10 would say Ash. But his conference records (5-3, 5-3, 4-4) are not markedly better than those of Huse. And you can argue direction all you want, but the sheer numbers don't point to much improvement from Ash either.

You are preachin' to the choir on that one my friend. I believe Ash has gotten a huge pass, as compared to Huse. In three years he has not even once had as good a season as the year before he took over, and yet most fans do seem to view him as the "great savior" as you say. Even the vast majority of UM fans seem to think extremely highly of him, some going so far as to say they would rather have Ash as their coach versus Hauck, despite Hauck's long successful tenure there. I am also very frustrated with the continued mediocrity of the basketball program, but you are right in saying that the acual results don't justify the almost unconditional support for Ash, as compared to the high degree of disatisfaction with Huse.

[TomCat88]

Don't you think the Ash backers are mostly Kramer bashers and vice versa?

[SonomaCat]

I believe Ash has gotten a huge pass, as compared to Huse. In three years he has not even once had as good a season as the year before he took over,

If your only measure is wins and losses, this is true. There are a few more, incredibly huge, factors in play that probably need to be considered.

[BobCatFan]

I have not been following basketball since I left Bozeman. I guess that goes back to the lack luster teams we have had for the past decade. Why follow a team that is always around .500 level. Huse will get another year, but he better make it a dam good one if he wants to keep his job. Please MSU, do not keep a coach around like you did with Durham, just because he has been around for a long time and is a good guy. We need hungry young coaches that want to move up. I do not think we had that for 20 plus years on the basketball side.

[whitetrashgriz]

Why follow a team that is always around .500 level.

because you are a fan? and you have pride in the teams you support? of course this isn't true for everyone. many people like to hop from team to team and only support the teams that are winning. maybe i should do that too. it'd be really easy to be a fan of the griz, and gators, and kansas basketball, and the yankees, and the lakers, and the colts. but i'm an idiot and i love bobcat basketball and football. i love the minnesota gophers. and the twins and vikings. hell, i'm so stupid i still root for the timberwolves! but, like i said...i'm dumb.

[John K]

Don't you think the Ash backers are mostly Kramer bashers and vice versa?

That is probably true to some degree, although maybe somewhat of an oversimplification. I just look at Ash as a guy who came in following the most successful five year period for the football program in the past 20 years, and so far has not been able to replicate that success. On the other hand, Huse came to a program that had been stumbling recently, after having enjoyed some very successful seasons during the mid to late 90's, and essentially done no better or no worse than Durham. Yet Ash is hailed almost universally as the greatest thing since sliced bread, while most MSU fans are calling for Huse's head.

[John K]

I believe Ash has gotten a huge pass, as compared to Huse. In three years he has not even once had as good a season as the year before he took over,

If your only measure is wins and losses, this is true. There are a few more, incredibly huge, factors in play that probably need to be considered.

Equitable or not, fair or foul, that is essentially what it comes down to for major college head coaches. By all accounts, Earle Solomonson was one of the nicest people you would ever meet, and ran a squeeky clean program, but do any Bobcat fans want him back as our football coach?

[TomCat88]

Most coaches realize they have 3-4 years to show improvement or to 'do something.' I recall Kramer and Ash saying basically the same thing and we've all heard coaches being interviewed and studio experts say this. I'm sure that Huse and Ash are fully aware that they need to produce (W/L and classroom; not 'or', but 'and') in order to stay on the job. Not enough people are going to like the coach after 3-4 years of nothing for an administrator to keep them. This isn't to say fans shouldn't engage in their back-n-forth banter, because its their prerogative and the coaches/admin expect it to a point where they say if the fans didn't complain it'd mean they don't care, which is the worst thing that can happen.

The two biggest strikes against Ash are that he hasn't gotten MSU in the playoffs in three years and that he has just one win against the top three teams in the league. If you take that at face value, then it's not good because MSU should be in the playoffs every three years and with 2010 having two more at-large spots it really puts the pressure on. If you consider that he joined the team in May his first year and has been not just injury-riddled, but injury-plagued his next two years, then you would have to return a grade of Incomplete at this point. Yes, injuries are part of the game. So much so that if you have too many they will cause you to start losing.

The two biggest strikes against Huse are that he hasn't finished above .500 in league play and that his teams have gone 1-4, 0-4, and 0-4 to finish league play the past three seasons. He has, however, followed that up with a good run in the tournament last season and now has himself in position to finish above .500 for the first time, which would be at least a three-game swing from last year. A loss to Sac State this week would be brutal, so it's not a done deal yet, but two wins and third place would be hard to criticize.

[GOKATS]

Don't you think the Ash backers are mostly Kramer bashers and vice versa?

That is probably true to some degree, although maybe somewhat of an oversimplification. I just look at Ash as a guy who came in following the most successful five year period for the football program in the past 20 years, and so far has not been able to replicate that success. On the other hand, Huse came to a program that had been stumbling recently, after having enjoyed some very successful seasons during the mid to late 90's, and essentially done no better or no worse than Durham. Yet Ash is hailed almost universally as the greatest thing since sliced bread, while most MSU fans are calling for Huse's head.

I'm just wondering where you get your numbers. Is it the handful of posters here who agree with you or is it your small cirlce of friends in Great Falls. I talk Bobcat athletics daily with folks and for me to say that 'most MSU fans' are calling for Huse's head would not be any where close to the truth. Just curious.................