Good-Bad-Ugly- MercyHurst

[Msucat5]

I posted this in the wrong thread but second times a charm

Good : Red Zone defense, Julius Davis, late September weather

Bad - Total misdiagnosis of this game by box score warriors - offense gave the ball back to MH twice. The real issue was our defense between the 20’s, MH got everything they wanted

Ugly - Student section always messing up the Go Cats Go during the fight song because they’re too excited for the ESG

[NewBobCatGuy]

When their number three wrapped up Lamson’s ankle and kept holding and twisting it to an obvious (but not called) personal foul - I needed to see a lineman run over and flatten that dude for messing with our qb. But nothing happened.

And get a penalty? This isn’t a movie.

lol ok. Send a freakin message. It’s just not that, it’s standing around not pushing the pile. They talked about being violent - need to see that. Also- you think linemen like JP Flynn would’ve let that crap slide? Heck no. Take the penalty there and fire up the whole team.

I mean they are the DJ Mafia, a message needs to be sent.

Loved the DJM culture. Seemed to leave with Coach Johnson? Great OL talent on the 1's and several on the 2's...yet to be tested. "Run the damn ball"

[Sotallytober]

MH just showed an effective game plan that could hurt us down the road against more talented players.

This is something that sounds more insightful than it is. This is every good teams' gameplan against every opponent. SDSU and NDSU (and UM, UI, UC Davis, etc.) already know the best way to win is to minimize their opponent's possessions and take the most advantage of the possessions you have.

[TomCat88]

MH just showed an effective game plan that could hurt us down the road against more talented players.

This is something that sounds more insightful than it is. This is every good teams' gameplan against every opponent. SDSU and NDSU (and UM, UI, UC Davis, etc.) already know the best way to win is to minimize their opponent's possessions and take the most advantage of the possessions you have.

I finally remembered a game that this game (opp. offense vs MSU def.) reminded me of. Idaho in 2023.

The Vandals kept the ball away from MSU, except Idaho was able to get stops (3 and outs) until the last drive of the half and instead of being down 17-0, they were up 10-0. But Idaho went for it a lot on fourth downs, and they were successful enough doing that to get that lead and held on for the win.

MH was only 4-14 on third downs, but was 4-7 on fourth down, which basically made them 8 for 14 on third downs. They had six possessions and turned it over on downs three times, turnovers twice and one punt. Drives of 11, 13, and 19 plays.

In 2023, vs the Vandals they were 6 of 15 on third down but 3 of 4 on fourth down, so 9 of 15. Idaho had drives of 10, 11, 15 and 20 plays.

MSU played the run well in both games, but the QBs had good days to offset that.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I don’t think I’ve seen anybody mention it, but the pass rush was nearly non-existent. Has me more than a bit concerned.

[TomCat88]

I don’t think I’ve seen anybody mention it, but the pass rush was nearly non-existent. Has me more than a bit concerned.

Short, quick passes?

[MSU01]

I don’t think I’ve seen anybody mention it, but the pass rush was nearly non-existent. Has me more than a bit concerned.

Short, quick passes?

Yeah, I felt that it was more how Mercyhurst was running their offense than a lack of pass rush by MSU. If their QB had been standing back there for 5 or 6 seconds with a clean pocket to throw from then that would have been concerning, but you can only do so much when the opponent is calling quick throws to get the ball out of the QB's hands as fast as possible.

[msugr8]

Tomcat,
How does 4/14 on 3rd down plus 4/7 on 4th down = 8/14 on 3rd down?
I get your point, we did great on 3rd and poor on 4th which was very painful to watch.
Really disappointing time of possession to experience on short end. Goal line stands were very impressive.

[BelligerentBobcat]

I don’t think I’ve seen anybody mention it, but the pass rush was nearly non-existent. Has me more than a bit concerned.

Short, quick passes?

Even then, they just weren’t penetrating. I think they’re stellar in the run game, can’t say I’m real impressed with the pass rush. Outside of blitzing, they just aren’t getting a lot of pressure and I’d say that’s true in every game so far.

[TomCat88]

I don’t think I’ve seen anybody mention it, but the pass rush was nearly non-existent. Has me more than a bit concerned.

Short, quick passes?

Even then, they just weren’t penetrating. I think they’re stellar in the run game, can’t say I’m real impressed with the pass rush. Outside of blitzing, they just aren’t getting a lot of pressure and I’d say that’s true in every game so far.

Yeah, I don't think the pass rush has been good all year. Excusable vs Oregon. I'm not sure if there's a good explanation for the other games overall.

[TomCat88]

Tomcat,
How does 4/14 on 3rd down plus 4/7 on 4th down = 8/14 on 3rd down?
I get your point, we did great on 3rd and poor on 4th which was very painful to watch.
Really disappointing time of possession to experience on short end. Goal line stands were very impressive.

If you fail on third but make it on fourth it has essentially the same outcome as having made it on third. Kind of like Sacks are TFLs, but TFLs aren't Sacks. Make sense?

[onceacat]

MH just showed an effective game plan that could hurt us down the road against more talented players.

This is something that sounds more insightful than it is. This is every good teams' gameplan against every opponent. SDSU and NDSU (and UM, UI, UC Davis, etc.) already know the best way to win is to minimize their opponent's possessions and take the most advantage of the possessions you have.

This ALSO sounds more insightful than it is.

Both teams get the same number of possessions. So if you minimize your opponents possession, you also minimize your own.

[onceacat]

MH just showed an effective game plan that could hurt us down the road against more talented players.

This is something that sounds more insightful than it is. This is every good teams' gameplan against every opponent. SDSU and NDSU (and UM, UI, UC Davis, etc.) already know the best way to win is to minimize their opponent's possessions and take the most advantage of the possessions you have.

I finally remembered a game that this game (opp. offense vs MSU def.) reminded me of. Idaho in 2023.

The Vandals kept the ball away from MSU, except Idaho was able to get stops (3 and outs) until the last drive of the half and instead of being down 17-0, they were up 10-0. But Idaho went for it a lot on fourth downs, and they were successful enough doing that to get that lead and held on for the win.

MH was only 4-14 on third downs, but was 4-7 on fourth down, which basically made them 8 for 14 on third downs. They had six possessions and turned it over on downs three times, turnovers twice and one punt. Drives of 11, 13, and 19 plays.

In 2023, vs the Vandals they were 6 of 15 on third down but 3 of 4 on fourth down, so 9 of 15. Idaho had drives of 10, 11, 15 and 20 plays.

MSU played the run well in both games, but the QBs had good days to offset that.

A punt is essentially a turnover. A long one, but a turnover nevertheless. So if your offense can get into 4th and manageable, you can avoid a turnover, increase your chance of scoring, and decrease your opponents chance of scoring. There’s a lot of data suggesting that teams punt too often relative to the benefits of converting 50-50 on 4th and short.

Vigen runs a really conservative, old school mentality on offense, but for a team like Mercyhurst that is at a significant talent disparity, you absolutely go for it on 4th because it’s a high reward, no real risk gambit.

You gotta score against a better, stronger, bigger faster team & MH can’t score if they punt the ball away.

[technoCat]

I don’t think I’ve seen anybody mention it, but the pass rush was nearly non-existent. Has me more than a bit concerned.

Short, quick passes?

Even then, they just weren’t penetrating. I think they’re stellar in the run game, can’t say I’m real impressed with the pass rush. Outside of blitzing, they just aren’t getting a lot of pressure and I’d say that’s true in every game so far.

I mean we had 3 sacks. At least twice as many tfls in the run game. The secondary was 10 yards off a lot and the lbs were too static in the zone. Urena would usually throw to a spot in under 2 seconds where he knew a receiver could find a hole in the zone. Plus they went on several 10+ play drives and I bet our DL was worn out. Give them credit, they took what we gave them and were consistent as hell until they got inside the 10 and the field was compressed.

[TomCat88]

MH just showed an effective game plan that could hurt us down the road against more talented players.

This is something that sounds more insightful than it is. This is every good teams' gameplan against every opponent. SDSU and NDSU (and UM, UI, UC Davis, etc.) already know the best way to win is to minimize their opponent's possessions and take the most advantage of the possessions you have.

I finally remembered a game that this game (opp. offense vs MSU def.) reminded me of. Idaho in 2023.

The Vandals kept the ball away from MSU, except Idaho was able to get stops (3 and outs) until the last drive of the half and instead of being down 17-0, they were up 10-0. But Idaho went for it a lot on fourth downs, and they were successful enough doing that to get that lead and held on for the win.

MH was only 4-14 on third downs, but was 4-7 on fourth down, which basically made them 8 for 14 on third downs. They had six possessions and turned it over on downs three times, turnovers twice and one punt. Drives of 11, 13, and 19 plays.

In 2023, vs the Vandals they were 6 of 15 on third down but 3 of 4 on fourth down, so 9 of 15. Idaho had drives of 10, 11, 15 and 20 plays.

MSU played the run well in both games, but the QBs had good days to offset that.

A punt is essentially a turnover. A long one, but a turnover nevertheless. So if your offense can get into 4th and manageable, you can avoid a turnover, increase your chance of scoring, and decrease your opponents chance of scoring. There’s a lot of data suggesting that teams punt too often relative to the benefits of converting 50-50 on 4th and short.

Vigen runs a really conservative, old school mentality on offense, but for a team like Mercyhurst that is at a significant talent disparity, you absolutely go for it on 4th because it’s a high reward, no real risk gambit.

You gotta score against a better, stronger, bigger faster team & MH can’t score if they punt the ball away.

A touchdown is a turnover.

[49thparallel]

The good: Run defense and pass protection
The bad: QB field vision seems lacking and poor judgement throwing into multiple coverages. Would prefer to see him only run when flushed from the pocket or goal line attempts.
The Ugly: This felt like watching the worse game we've ever won. The offense seemed sluggish and out of sync (not sure how "much better" Mercyhurst is if Sac St beat them by 21 points) Also, I thought our offense looked better the two previous games, and if we don't start making improvements, we'll be dropping some games in conference play.

[onceacat]

MH just showed an effective game plan that could hurt us down the road against more talented players.

This is something that sounds more insightful than it is. This is every good teams' gameplan against every opponent. SDSU and NDSU (and UM, UI, UC Davis, etc.) already know the best way to win is to minimize their opponent's possessions and take the most advantage of the possessions you have.

I finally remembered a game that this game (opp. offense vs MSU def.) reminded me of. Idaho in 2023.

The Vandals kept the ball away from MSU, except Idaho was able to get stops (3 and outs) until the last drive of the half and instead of being down 17-0, they were up 10-0. But Idaho went for it a lot on fourth downs, and they were successful enough doing that to get that lead and held on for the win.

MH was only 4-14 on third downs, but was 4-7 on fourth down, which basically made them 8 for 14 on third downs. They had six possessions and turned it over on downs three times, turnovers twice and one punt. Drives of 11, 13, and 19 plays.

In 2023, vs the Vandals they were 6 of 15 on third down but 3 of 4 on fourth down, so 9 of 15. Idaho had drives of 10, 11, 15 and 20 plays.

MSU played the run well in both games, but the QBs had good days to offset that.

A punt is essentially a turnover. A long one, but a turnover nevertheless. So if your offense can get into 4th and manageable, you can avoid a turnover, increase your chance of scoring, and decrease your opponents chance of scoring. There’s a lot of data suggesting that teams punt too often relative to the benefits of converting 50-50 on 4th and short.

Vigen runs a really conservative, old school mentality on offense, but for a team like Mercyhurst that is at a significant talent disparity, you absolutely go for it on 4th because it’s a high reward, no real risk gambit.

You gotta score against a better, stronger, bigger faster team & MH can’t score if they punt the ball away.

A touchdown is a turnover.

I guess, except that it leave you with more points than the other guys

[PortlandCat90]

Good: Out of curiosity I looked into the team defense stats YTD excluding the Ducks. Pretty damn solid. 8 points per game in regulation and very solid yards per rush/pass etc. I like our D if we can keep the LB depth.

Good: Cole Taylor. Future NFL. Forgot he holds CMR’s QB passing records.

Good: DBs hitting at the LOS. What I thought was going to be a major weakness is really taking shape.

Good: Lamson. A few are down on him but what a warrior. Glad to have him here.

Bad: We still don’t have a rotation for the O-Line. Hard to swallow. We know we will lose 2 – 3 during the season. My corporate executive brain takes over here and I feel that we should have a plan with several alternatives in place depending on who goes down. This is big but the killer is….

Ugly: I believe there is one issue that will kill us in Big Sky play and playoffs if we don’t get it figured out: lack of WR speed/ deep threat. We are ahead of only PeeSU in the Big Sky at YPC and we are under 10 yards average. The number of pass completions in double digit yards needs viagra. Lamson is 2nd in FCS pass completion (75%) but the lack of deep threat will kill us. Hopefully Long and Woods will be used strategically in this area.

Still Drinking: It’s been widely written how strange the Mercyhurst game unfolded. The second long drive started at their 42 and they had 12 plays inside our 25 yard line; 4 plays from our 1 yard line. From our 25 their plays netted 0, 6, 4, 9, 0, -5, 5, 5, 1, 0, 0, Pick. Strange game.

[catgrad05]

MH just showed an effective game plan that could hurt us down the road against more talented players.

This is something that sounds more insightful than it is. This is every good teams' gameplan against every opponent. SDSU and NDSU (and UM, UI, UC Davis, etc.) already know the best way to win is to minimize their opponent's possessions and take the most advantage of the possessions you have.

I finally remembered a game that this game (opp. offense vs MSU def.) reminded me of. Idaho in 2023.

The Vandals kept the ball away from MSU, except Idaho was able to get stops (3 and outs) until the last drive of the half and instead of being down 17-0, they were up 10-0. But Idaho went for it a lot on fourth downs, and they were successful enough doing that to get that lead and held on for the win.

MH was only 4-14 on third downs, but was 4-7 on fourth down, which basically made them 8 for 14 on third downs. They had six possessions and turned it over on downs three times, turnovers twice and one punt. Drives of 11, 13, and 19 plays.

In 2023, vs the Vandals they were 6 of 15 on third down but 3 of 4 on fourth down, so 9 of 15. Idaho had drives of 10, 11, 15 and 20 plays.

MSU played the run well in both games, but the QBs had good days to offset that.

A punt is essentially a turnover. A long one, but a turnover nevertheless. So if your offense can get into 4th and manageable, you can avoid a turnover, increase your chance of scoring, and decrease your opponents chance of scoring. There’s a lot of data suggesting that teams punt too often relative to the benefits of converting 50-50 on 4th and short.

Vigen runs a really conservative, old school mentality on offense, but for a team like Mercyhurst that is at a significant talent disparity, you absolutely go for it on 4th because it’s a high reward, no real risk gambit.

You gotta score against a better, stronger, bigger faster team & MH can’t score if they punt the ball away.

I had flashbacks of the Ash years with this perspective

[Helcat72]

I don't think people realize how hard it is to run the ball like we did during Tommy's time. No one in the country ran that well. Remember how running the ball was in 2021 before Tommy took over. About like it is now. We are still good, but we need to improve our passing game to come anywhere close to that productivity. 2022-2024 was an anomaly.