Cats vs. Griz - recruiting advantages (split)

Air_Griz · Post by **Air_Griz** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 2:11 pm

Cat Grad wrote:
MTBobcatFan wrote:
GRIZNBZMN wrote:
You hit the nail on the head???
Then can you tell me what MSU has over UM in a recruiting battle? Honestly- you're an 18 year old and visiting both venues...

amazing stadium, great facilities, 23K loud "smart" (ask Coach Kill of S. Illinois, said they were the most knowledgeable fans in the country, actually U.S. is what he said, verbatim) great tailgates, not to mention streak of playoff appearances as well as national championship appearances

vs.

decent stadium (it's getting better), don't know about the facilities, 11-13K fans (depending on the weather), mediocre records, not even sure what they are but seem to lose around 4 games a year, and one playoff in the last how many years?

Tell me where you'd go? Be honest!

I like how Griz fans like to point out when their fans are called "smart". Seriously, how hard is it to figure out to yell when the opponent has the ball? It's something you can train a drunk lab monkey to do.
Are you implying the crowd in Denny's Sandbox are usually drunk lab monkies?

That is exactly the implication - we are all a bunch of drunk lab monkies. And we're darn proud of it. Heck, sometimes we even get really, really drunk at our tailgate parties and intimidate the game officials by sticking eggs and other items in the exhaust of their vehicles.

Surpriningly, the Griz have amazingly maintained a sterling reputation throughout the rest of the Nation who share a uniquely different perspective than those shared on this thread.

It is the very legend of WA-Griz that affords the GRIZ a clearcut advantage over every team in the Big Sky when it comes to recruiting. The kids are awestruck by the sheer energy and excitement that encompasses WA-Griz.

Now, that is fact.

Cat Grad · Post by **Cat Grad** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 2:19 pm

Obviously a drunk lab monkey

Air_Griz · Post by **Air_Griz** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 2:24 pm

Cat Grad wrote:Obviously a drunk lab monkey

I feel sorry for those who don't drink. When they get up in the morning, that is the best they are going to feel all day.

El_Gato · Post by **El_Gato** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 2:31 pm

GRIZNBZMN wrote:...I wonder who the last high school recruit was that told Bobby, I'm not gonna take your full ride to UM, I think I'll go to MSU...

I'm sure there've been a few but I know for certain that a current Montana High School star will do just that in the coming months and will end up being an all-conference performer before he's done.

griznbzmn,

You are correct about a lot of your points, which makes it even MORE amazing and impressive what Coach Kramer has done in building the Bobcat Football program into what it is today, given the recruiting advantages held by the Griz. I've always said if I were a recruit or had a son who was being recruited by the 2 schools and I had no bias one way or the other regarding either school, I'd choose the Griz for all the reasons you've mentioned.

BUT, this year there were 39 Montana kids listed on the Cats roster and 43 on the Griz so it's obvious that we've gained significant ground. Yes, the Griz still tend to get more of the "cream of the crop" from Montana, but again, that gap is closing. NO ONE could have evened the playing field faster than Coach Kramer has; if we are lucky enough to keep him, you will continue to see that trend continue, to the point where eventually BOTH teams have a significant # of MT kids getting scholarships and playing key roles on the team.

Egg Salad · Post by **Egg Salad** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:28 pm

MTBobcatFan wrote:
GRIZNBZMN wrote:
You hit the nail on the head???
Then can you tell me what MSU has over UM in a recruiting battle? Honestly- you're an 18 year old and visiting both venues...

amazing stadium, great facilities, 23K loud "smart" (ask Coach Kill of S. Illinois, said they were the most knowledgeable fans in the country, actually U.S. is what he said, verbatim) great tailgates, not to mention streak of playoff appearances as well as national championship appearances

vs.

decent stadium (it's getting better), don't know about the facilities, 11-13K fans (depending on the weather), mediocre records, not even sure what they are but seem to lose around 4 games a year, and one playoff in the last how many years?

Tell me where you'd go? Be honest!

I like how Griz fans like to point out when their fans are called "smart". Seriously, how hard is it to figure out to yell when the opponent has the ball? It's something you can train a drunk lab monkey to do.

You rang?

CARDIAC_CATS · Post by **CARDIAC_CATS** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:38 pm

GRIZNBZMN wrote:
You hit the nail on the head???
Then can you tell me what MSU has over UM in a recruiting battle? Honestly- you're an 18 year old and visiting both venues...

amazing stadium, great facilities, 23K loud "smart" (ask Coach Kill of S. Illinois, said they were the most knowledgeable fans in the country, actually U.S. is what he said, verbatim) great tailgates, not to mention streak of playoff appearances as well as national championship appearances

vs.

decent stadium (it's getting better), don't know about the facilities, 11-13K fans (depending on the weather), mediocre records, not even sure what they are but seem to lose around 4 games a year, and one playoff in the last how many years?

Tell me where you'd go? Be honest!

I would go where I can get a job after football (.5% go to NFL if that?) ===> EASY CHOICE .. MSU

P.S - By job I do not mean Mcdonald's (even if a manager position there )

CARDIAC_CATS · Post by **CARDIAC_CATS** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:40 pm

Topher wrote:
Bay Area Cat wrote:
STREETCAT wrote:
GRIZNBZMN wrote:
You hit the nail on the head???
Then can you tell me what MSU has over UM in a recruiting battle? Honestly- you're an 18 year old and visiting both venues...

amazing stadium, great facilities, 23K loud "smart" (ask Coach Kill of S. Illinois, said they were the most knowledgeable fans in the country, actually U.S. is what he said, verbatim) great tailgates, not to mention streak of playoff appearances as well as national championship appearances

vs.

decent stadium (it's getting better), don't know about the facilities, 11-13K fans (depending on the weather), mediocre records, not even sure what they are but seem to lose around 4 games a year, and one playoff in the last how many years?

Tell me where you'd go? Be honest!
WELL IF I WANTED TO BE AN ART MAJOR OR LETS SEE, A FILM MAJOR, OR SETTLE FOR A BUSINESS DEGREE THEN UM

BUT IF I WANT TO BE AN ENGINEER, ARCHITECT, PRE-MED, OR ANY SCIENCE MAJOR, I WOULD GO TO BOZEMAN

HAVENT YOU SEEN THE COMERCIALS? ALLMOST ALL ATHLETES GO PRO IN SOMETHING ELSE.
MSU has a great film program, actually. MSU has a very good (arguably much better than UM) business program as well.

I could take exception to your "settle for a business degree" statement ... but I'm not that insecure. I guess those of us business majors who donate to MSU will just have to find someplace that appreciates our money, eh?
Ok, I have to admit, I get a little muddled when it comes to people arguing the phantom superiority of MSU academia. I got my degree in Psychology, a field MSU offers significantly fewer courses in. My class also boasted the son of a Professor teaching at MSU. When I asked him why he chose to attend the U he claimed, "because it has a better Psychology program", and when asked why, "more opportunities". It is a fact, check your class listings!

We have produced more Rhodes scholars than you have (17th in the Nation, 5th in public schools), and we have a little thing called the Davidson's Honors College for students who want a higher challenge. I looked EQUALLY at both schools, and The University of Montana was the better choice for academic reasons.

They are both third tier State schools. If you are holding on to the glory of MSU academics as a reason for looking down upon The University of Montana than you are living in a fantasy world. Both schools provide equal opportunity for students desiring to achieve their goals in the real world.

And as for the original poster whom insists on gloating about a stadium he had absolutely nothing to do with here are a few answers to your question.
1) MSU is a better fit for their style of play
2) Had/has a family whom played/plays for the Cats
3) Chance to play right away, or perhaps UM is already set in his position (more playing opportunities)
4) Grew up a Cat fan (it's not that hard to believe, it happens)
5) Likes the coaching perosnal at MSU better
6) Prefers going to school in Bozeman
7) Wants to get a degree in a field MSU has a stronger background. I have a friend whom chose to play football at Montana Tech over the I-AA schools because he liked their engineer program. Plus UM and MSU wanted him to walk and see what happens.
Former High School teammates now play for the Cats/Current friends also play for the Cats
9) Family lives closer to Bozeman/Easier for them to watch him play at MSU-Stay closer to family
10) Attended games at both Universities and preferred MSU (this also happens).

So in conclusion, You need more than the ominous "we have higher standards" to convince me MSU is a better school (don't get me wrong I think MSU provides every opportunity in the world for students, I just believe UM does this equally). There are MANY reasons why a Montana highschool football player would choose MSU over UM. I have listed 10 good ones. Peace

1) MSU is a better fit for their style of play
2) Had/has a family whom played/plays for the Cats
3) Chance to play right away, or perhaps UM is already set in his position (more playing opportunities)
4) Grew up a Cat fan (it's not that hard to believe, it happens)
5) Likes the coaching perosnal at MSU better
6) Prefers going to school in Bozeman
7) Wants to get a degree in a field MSU has a stronger background. I have a friend whom chose to play football at Montana Tech over the I-AA schools because he liked their engineer program. Plus UM and MSU wanted him to walk and see what happens.

Former High School teammates now play for the Cats/Current friends also play for the Cats
9) Family lives closer to Bozeman/Easier for them to watch him play at MSU-Stay closer to family
10) Attended games at both Universities and preferred MSU (this also happens).

All VERY GOOD POINTS! There are lots of reasons and a lot of good players to go around that match these criteria.

theblackgecko · Post by **theblackgecko** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:41 pm

94VegasCat wrote:I would consider the coaches and their personalities as an option. Kramer can sell ice cubes to eskimos and Huack is a chump

Maybe. For the record, Kramer has a well-known habit of criticizing his players' performance in the media, while Hauck is known for not saying much of anything.

CatFamily · Post by **CatFamily** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:43 pm

Per Air Griz
"That is exactly the implication - we are all a bunch of drunk lab monkies. And we're darn proud of it. Heck, sometimes we even get really, really drunk at our tailgate parties and intimidate the game officials by sticking eggs and other items in the exhaust of their vehicles. "

Maybe you should mention that at UM you even stand over the tunnel of the visiting teams, spit on them, curse and scream, and act so classy .... or when the teams come into the stadium (as did McNeese State) and while walking in there were 10-15 people or so cursing at them, name calling and screaming and again act so classy... Is that whay you are referring too?

Post by **SonomaCat** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:57 pm

As a wise man once said, "Let the fanbase that it is without a classless fan cast the first stone."

catamaran · Post by **catamaran** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:59 pm

GRIZNBZMN · Post by **GRIZNBZMN** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:39 pm

If all you want an answer, then quit arguing when you're given one.

Can you give me an example of me arguing? Are you possibly a little defensive?? I did get an answer from someone regarding academics making the choice for some, said thanks, made a joke about tree huggers and that was it.

Is something else bothering you about this post?

Swilly3224 · Post by **Swilly3224** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:50 pm

Since I am a 17 year old kid that would probably know alot about this subject than most of you, ill add my two cents.

Recruiting in the state of MT is mainly consisted of what coach you like better, or what school you've grown up being a fan of. Facilities have some what to do with it, but alot less than you would think. Playing time is a huge factor but a contradiction to that is the winning tradtion that UM has built. It varies from kid to kid and there is no one reason that UM or MSU has the advantage over each other.

Just my experiences

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:58 pm

Unfortunately for Swirly, neither school offers schollies in hacky-sack or skateboarding.

Post by **kmax** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:59 pm

Swilly3224 wrote:Since I am a 17 year old kid that would probably know alot about this subject than most of you, ill add my two cents.

Recruiting in the state of MT is mainly consisted of what coach you like better, or what school you've grown up being a fan of. Facilities have some what to do with it, but alot less than you would think. Playing time is a huge factor but a contradiction to that is the winning tradtion that UM has built. It varies from kid to kid and there is no one reason that UM or MSU has the advantage over each other.

Just my experiences

Alright, who the hell stole Swilly's password?!?

Just kidding swilly, excellent post.

GRIZNBZMN · Post by **GRIZNBZMN** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 5:00 pm

I would consider the coaches and their personalities as an option. Kramer can sell ice cubes to eskimos and Huack is a chump

I actually have friends that have played for both coaches. I know this may come as a suprise but the guys that played for coach K didn't have real good things to say. I've never heard anyone refer to him as a "players coach", he's definitely more of a media guy. I guess that makes him popular w/ media, fans, boosters, you guys, etc.

I have heard Haucks players refer to him as a "players coach" numerous times when people ask about his personality. He's not a media guy, doesn't suck up to boosters and basically doesn't care what any of you think of him. He takes care of his team, period. I have yet to hear him call out his own players, the guys that work their tails off day in day out for him, in the newspaper. Some call that motivation, some call it stupid. I'm with the latter.

I'm sure both have their strong points, personally I would rather have a coach like Hauck. I'm not into coaches trying to impress people w/ 4 syllable words they looked up in the dictionary that week and try to interject to sound smart.

I realize this post is purely my opinion, both coaches have players that like and dislike them, and in the scheme of things, it's really not the job of the coaches to have the players "like" them. But like you said, Kramer can sell ice cubes to eskimos You guys can keep Kramer, the ice, and the eskimos-- we'll stick w/ our chump of a coach that somehow keeps leading us to the national championship!

crazycat · Post by **crazycat** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 5:18 pm

You know players that have played for both Hauck and Kramer? I don't want you to name names, but can you explain a scenario where a player could've done this? I'm intrigued.

The reason I ask, is becauce Kramer's been at either MSU or EW for the past 13 years and Hauck is about 38, so was probably 25 or so when Kramer started at EWU. I'm guessing then that a player under Hauck, who would've only been an assistant at the time, must've dropped down from UCLA or Colorado to go to EW or MSU and then you met this guy and he told you this.

Your statements about who's a better coach are just going to wrap us back into the "If Kramer was UM's coach and Hauck was MSU's coach, where would the two schools be" conversation. We've had that so many times, we all know how it ends. The Griz would be about right where they're at, but the Bobcats would be in the tank. Not trying to be mean, but personality-wise Hauck reminds me of Solomonson.

El_Gato · Post by **El_Gato** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 5:24 pm

GRIZNBZMN wrote:...we'll stick w/ our chump of a coach that somehow keeps leading us to the national championship!

I'm sorry, I didn't realize Hauck had lead you to a national championship?! How did I miss that???

(Sorry, griznbzmn, I just couldn't resist)

catatac · Post by **catatac** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 5:51 pm

No, he doesn't know players that have played for both. Sounds like he's just stirring the pot. I know for a fact there are certain players who hated playing under Hauck. There are also those that love him... just like Kramer. I've heard a couple stories of players not liking Kramer but I hear WAY more stories about how they love him.

jagur1 · Post by **jagur1** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:00 pm

catatac wrote:No, he doesn't know players that have played for both. Sounds like he's just stirring the pot. I know for a fact there are certain players who hated playing under Hauck. There are also those that love him... just like Kramer. I've heard a couple stories of players not liking Kramer but I hear WAY more stories about how they love him.

Don't you guys have a guy on your staff that played for UW then went to MSU for a second chance? Could he have played for both? I don't know just asking. Maybe a ex CU Buff?