QB Talk

[Cataholic]

At a QB Club meeting Vigen mentioned that Reed can do things Tommy and Sean cannot do. He did not elaborate but I took it to mean a better passer.

And you would be right. Reed is light years ahead of Tommy in terms of a passer. The staff knows this and I really hope they allow Reed to continue to develop in game situations.

What evidence do you have to support that statement?

[GoldstoneCat]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

Just look to the west, at our level. Montana won a natty behind Johnny Montana and got there with Cole Bergquist. Rex Grossman and Jake Delhomme both started super bowls this century. You can absolutely win with a game manager type and a QB proof roster. I just don't think we have a qb proof roster. Thankfully, we have a guy that's played a ton of football and played in a lot of big games. We have a chance to win a championship with Tommy. If he's not our QB this is a team that might finish 4th in the BSC.

[Justwinbaby]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

Just look to the west, at our level. Montana won a natty behind Johnny Montana and got there with Cole Bergquist. Rex Grossman and Jake Delhomme both started super bowls this century. You can absolutely win with a game manager type and a QB proof roster. I just don't think we have a qb proof roster. Thankfully, we have a guy that's played a ton of football and played in a lot of big games. We have a chance to win a championship with Tommy. If he's not our QB this is a team that might finish 4th in the BSC.

My opinion is we don't know if the team is QB proof yet. The team to the west was in a much worse QB situation last season and it took them several games to figure it out. They are in a similar spot this season. In our case - we have an elite FCS QB to start the season..and that's an enviable position. I'll take our QB room over theirs...

[tetoncat]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

Just look to the west, at our level. Montana won a natty behind Johnny Montana and got there with Cole Bergquist. Rex Grossman and Jake Delhomme both started super bowls this century. You can absolutely win with a game manager type and a QB proof roster. I just don't think we have a qb proof roster. Thankfully, we have a guy that's played a ton of football and played in a lot of big games. We have a chance to win a championship with Tommy. If he's not our QB this is a team that might finish 4th in the BSC.

I disagree. one of the top olines in the country, multiple strong RB, adequate WR, and good TE. We will see if we have a OC proof team. Last year we were strongest when 1 QB out and game plan fit the starter. We struggled when one went down and plan didn't seem to fit the backup. Will new OC be able to adapt better. Will we lean on run and take the play action and other passing that opens up.

[GoldstoneCat]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

Just look to the west, at our level. Montana won a natty behind Johnny Montana and got there with Cole Bergquist. Rex Grossman and Jake Delhomme both started super bowls this century. You can absolutely win with a game manager type and a QB proof roster. I just don't think we have a qb proof roster. Thankfully, we have a guy that's played a ton of football and played in a lot of big games. We have a chance to win a championship with Tommy. If he's not our QB this is a team that might finish 4th in the BSC.

I disagree. one of the top olines in the country, multiple strong RB, adequate WR, and good TE. We will see if we have a OC proof team. Last year we were strongest when 1 QB out and game plan fit the starter. We struggled when one went down and plan didn't seem to fit the backup. Will new OC be able to adapt better. Will we lean on run and take the play action and other passing that opens up.

Different strokes, as they say. Agree on oline, rb although I heard Davis will miss a good chunk of time, te is a bit unknown, and for me there are questions at all 3 levels of the defense and definitely in the kicking game.

[GoldstoneCat]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

Just look to the west, at our level. Montana won a natty behind Johnny Montana and got there with Cole Bergquist. Rex Grossman and Jake Delhomme both started super bowls this century. You can absolutely win with a game manager type and a QB proof roster. I just don't think we have a qb proof roster. Thankfully, we have a guy that's played a ton of football and played in a lot of big games. We have a chance to win a championship with Tommy. If he's not our QB this is a team that might finish 4th in the BSC.

My opinion is we don't know if the team is QB proof yet. The team to the west was in a much worse QB situation last season and it took them several games to figure it out. They are in a similar spot this season. In our case - we have an elite FCS QB to start the season..and that's an enviable position. I'll take our QB room over theirs...

Fair. I do not like our QB room at all behind Tommy. Not at all. As long as he's playing we are worthy of the hype, I think, but after that it ain't good. IMO.

[tetoncat]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

Just look to the west, at our level. Montana won a natty behind Johnny Montana and got there with Cole Bergquist. Rex Grossman and Jake Delhomme both started super bowls this century. You can absolutely win with a game manager type and a QB proof roster. I just don't think we have a qb proof roster. Thankfully, we have a guy that's played a ton of football and played in a lot of big games. We have a chance to win a championship with Tommy. If he's not our QB this is a team that might finish 4th in the BSC.

I disagree. one of the top olines in the country, multiple strong RB, adequate WR, and good TE. We will see if we have a OC proof team. Last year we were strongest when 1 QB out and game plan fit the starter. We struggled when one went down and plan didn't seem to fit the backup. Will new OC be able to adapt better. Will we lean on run and take the play action and other passing that opens up.

Different strokes, as they say. Agree on oline, rb although I heard Davis will miss a good chunk of time, te is a bit unknown, and for me there are questions at all 3 levels of the defense and definitely in the kicking game.

Yep lots of opinions. As good as Tommy is I just don't feel he can put us over the top on his own vs other QBs if there are weaknesses in other areas you stated.

[GoldstoneCat]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

Just look to the west, at our level. Montana won a natty behind Johnny Montana and got there with Cole Bergquist. Rex Grossman and Jake Delhomme both started super bowls this century. You can absolutely win with a game manager type and a QB proof roster. I just don't think we have a qb proof roster. Thankfully, we have a guy that's played a ton of football and played in a lot of big games. We have a chance to win a championship with Tommy. If he's not our QB this is a team that might finish 4th in the BSC.

I disagree. one of the top olines in the country, multiple strong RB, adequate WR, and good TE. We will see if we have a OC proof team. Last year we were strongest when 1 QB out and game plan fit the starter. We struggled when one went down and plan didn't seem to fit the backup. Will new OC be able to adapt better. Will we lean on run and take the play action and other passing that opens up.

Different strokes, as they say. Agree on oline, rb although I heard Davis will miss a good chunk of time, te is a bit unknown, and for me there are questions at all 3 levels of the defense and definitely in the kicking game.

Yep lots of opinions. As good as Tommy is I just don't feel he can put us over the top on his own vs other QBs if there are weaknesses in other areas you stated.

I agree with this part of your take. That team he led to frisco was loaded. He's certainly developed since then, especially as a leader and field general, but it's unclear to me how much better he is today than in December of 2021 at winning from the pocket. But I think, as you say, our success will be determined by how good the supporting cast turns out to be and how healthy we are.

[GoCats18]

I hope that not trying to go after a portal QB with playing experience won’t come back to bite us in the ass this season. If Tommy can stay 100% all season, I think it won’t matter but if he misses any time because of injuries, I think we are going to regret not having someone that is game ready.

[MSU01]

I hope that not trying to go after a portal QB with playing experience won’t come back to bite us in the ass this season. If Tommy can stay 100% all season, I think it won’t matter but if he misses any time because of injuries, I think we are going to regret not having someone that is game ready.

Yeah, we really need a highly touted portal QB like Sam Vidlak. Have a little faith in our coaches and current players, if they aren't going after portal QBs there's a good reason for that decision.

[Cats and Dogs]

I hope that not trying to go after a portal QB with playing experience won’t come back to bite us in the ass this season. If Tommy can stay 100% all season, I think it won’t matter but if he misses any time because of injuries, I think we are going to regret not having someone that is game ready.

Yeah, we really need a highly touted portal QB like Sam Vidlak. Have a little faith in our coaches and current players, if they aren't going after portal QBs there's a good reason for that decision.

That’s the optimistic take! Coach Vigen is fully aware of the expectations this senior class, team and passionate Bobcat fans everywhere, have for this season. Given Tommy’s style of play and history, if there isn’t another qb on the roster capable of starting and winning conference and playoff games, it will be squarely on his shoulders. He has to feel like the show will go on. If that’s not the case or the defense isn’t ready for a championship run then maybe he’s not who we think/hope he is as a head coach! Stuff happens out of anyone’s control but if this team’s personnel is not capable of a serious title run, it will be a huge disappointment! Especially after last year!
They needed to get better and I think Vigen gets it!
Go Cats!

[Justwinbaby]

I hope that not trying to go after a portal QB with playing experience won’t come back to bite us in the ass this season. If Tommy can stay 100% all season, I think it won’t matter but if he misses any time because of injuries, I think we are going to regret not having someone that is game ready.

Yeah, we really need a highly touted portal QB like Sam Vidlak. Have a little faith in our coaches and current players, if they aren't going after portal QBs there's a good reason for that decision.

This is exactly correct. We don't know the extent of the QB-room talent and potential (depth). The coaches do...

I'll stand by my statement - the QB room will NOT be the thing that keeps the team from returning to Frisco.

The problem will be on the other side of the ball...

[lutecat]

People are so enamored with quarterbacks that they forget that many teams go far and even win championships without good quarterbacks. Just look at all the FBS, FCS, NFL title contenders over the years. It’s a huge list. Then there’s the list of great quarterbacks that didn’t win championships.

A huge list? I can think of Nick Foles, and he caught a massive hot streak. I guess somebody could argue one of the Alabama QB’s, but we aren’t as far above our peers as those teams were talent wise.

Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Jim Plunkett all won superbowl.

I doubt many even remember half these guys:
Chris Weinke
Josh Heupel
Ken Dorsey
Tee Martin*
Matt Mauck
Chris Leak
Matt Flynn
Greg McElroy
Craig Krenzel
All won FBS titles.
*won the year after Peyton Manning left after not winning one.

Now do the other side of the equation. Name the QBs whole led FBS, FCS, AND NFL title contenders. I guarantee the list is longer and much more impressive.

Excellent and elite QBs matter much more than you imply.

I would do that, but I think most sports fans realize that good quarterbacks lead to title contending teams and I'm not implying that they don't. My point is that not all title contenders have good QBs and are led to their positions by good players/systems in other areas.

Let's look at just your 1st list above.

JOHNSON - played 17 NFL seasons. Played both D1 football and BB at Florida State. He'll of an athlete - a good QB.

DILFER - played 14 NFL seasons. College Sammy Baugh Trophy winner. 6th overall pick in 1994. 1997 Pro Bowl - a good QB.

RYPIEN - played 14 NFL seasons. 1st Team all PAC 10 QB. 2x Superbowl champ and 1 x MVP. 1991 All Pro and 2 x Pro bowls - a good QB.

HOSTETLER - played 14 years in NFL. 2 x super bowl champ. Pro bowl 1994. 3rd TM college All American - a good QB.

PLUNKETT - played 15 seasons in the NFL. 2x super bowl champ. 1x super bowl MVP. AFC rookie of the year. Heisman Trophy, Maxwell trophy, Walter Camp award. Consensus College All American. College FB Hall of Fame. 1st round draft pick - a good QB.

Every one of these guys were good to great QBs.

These were all guys with 1 probowl each? Maybe 2? That's not great qb's. So you can't say good to great qb's. I think at best you can say they were all average. They had great teams playing around then. Peyton manning was a great qb with average teams and sub average coaches. And a lot of pro bowls.

[CodyCat]

I hope that not trying to go after a portal QB with playing experience won’t come back to bite us in the ass this season. If Tommy can stay 100% all season, I think it won’t matter but if he misses any time because of injuries, I think we are going to regret not having someone that is game ready.

Yeah, we really need a highly touted portal QB like Sam Vidlak. Have a little faith in our coaches and current players, if they aren't going after portal QBs there's a good reason for that decision.

This is exactly correct. We don't know the extent of the QB-room talent and potential (depth). The coaches do...

I'll stand by my statement - the QB room will NOT be the thing that keeps the team from returning to Frisco.

The problem will be on the other side of the ball...

Where do you see the problems being on the defense?

[84CatGrad]

"We will see if we have a OC proof team."

What does that mean?

[tetoncat]

"We will see if we have a OC proof team."

What does that mean?

I'll try to explain my thought. Last year when one or other of the 2 QB were out ahead of time it seemed like game plans featured the strengths of the one playing. If both played against good teams it seemed each was more restricted on what we ran with them. And if To.my went out in game it was as if Chambers hadn't been prepped for full game plan. Hopefully without a 2 QB system the backup is fully prepared by OC to run the full plan for that week if necessary.

[catscat]

"We will see if we have a OC proof team."

What does that mean?

I'll try to explain my thought. Last year when one or other of the 2 QB were out ahead of time it seemed like game plans featured the strengths of the one playing. If both played against good teams it seemed each was more restricted on what we ran with them. And if To.my went out in game it was as if Chambers hadn't been prepped for full game plan. Hopefully without a 2 QB system the backup is fully prepared by OC to run the full plan for that week if necessary.

Just my opinion, but I think this has been a problem over the past 3 years. Take the NC - Tommy goes down and it looked to me like we were trying to run a Tommy game plan with Rovig. Seems to me that if the backup QB has a different skill set than the starter, you'd better have 2 game plans and QBs prepped to run them.

[technoCat]

"We will see if we have a OC proof team."

What does that mean?

I'll try to explain my thought. Last year when one or other of the 2 QB were out ahead of time it seemed like game plans featured the strengths of the one playing. If both played against good teams it seemed each was more restricted on what we ran with them. And if To.my went out in game it was as if Chambers hadn't been prepped for full game plan. Hopefully without a 2 QB system the backup is fully prepared by OC to run the full plan for that week if necessary.

Just my opinion, but I think this has been a problem over the past 3 years. Take the NC - Tommy goes down and it looked to me like we were trying to run a Tommy game plan with Rovig. Seems to me that if the backup QB has a different skill set than the starter, you'd better have 2 game plans and QBs prepped to run them.

Or the playoff game at SDSU, we were cramming it down their throat with Chambers and looked like we were just going to out muscle them. He gets hurt on that td and it was like they didn't know what to do with Tommy. When they finally decided to let him loose throwing the ball, it was too late.

[TomCat88]

"We will see if we have a OC proof team."

What does that mean?

I'll try to explain my thought. Last year when one or other of the 2 QB were out ahead of time it seemed like game plans featured the strengths of the one playing. If both played against good teams it seemed each was more restricted on what we ran with them. And if To.my went out in game it was as if Chambers hadn't been prepped for full game plan. Hopefully without a 2 QB system the backup is fully prepared by OC to run the full plan for that week if necessary.

I'm not saying you're wrong because I certainly don't have that much knowledge about the details of an OC's job, but I'd find it hard to believe that an OC at this level running a 2QB system isn't going to prepare both QBs for a game and be able to adjust a game plan accordingly. I don't expect them to be perfect but to fail at nearly every turn in this situation is hard to fathom. Most games with Mellott available/starting, Chambers was IMO a situational player who would primarily come in for three situations: short yardage, after a big gain, or to run some type of gadget play. When he did start Mellott was typically out for the game. I think there are coaches at this level that get stubborn and stick with a system too long, but I don't think many have the problem that you're describing.

I only recall two games where Mellott was injured, and Chambers was called on to run the game solo from there. SDSU and NDSU. Neither QB had a lot of success vs SDSU, but Chambers led an amazing, gutsy drive at the end of the game. I thought both QBs had good success vs NDSU and MSU probably wins the game if Chambers isn't hurt as I think he doesn't step out of bounds and scores in regulation. He made a mistake after that and perhaps was being asked to do something he just wasn't confident doing due to his injury, but it wasn't the first time he'd made that error so in that case it's on him and not the OC.

Sports can be very random even at the highest levels and players/coaches can just have a bad game no matter how good they are. Trying to pin too much responsibility on one player or coach is good for ratings on talk shows but I don't think it's very realistic in a macro sense. Yes, Steph Curry has gone Oh-fer-10 shooting 3s and the Warriors lost those games and Curry himself will take the blame. But to blame someone for failure over an entire season (or 3 seasons) is a stretch IMHO. I've heard numerous coaches and players take the blame for games but if a coach or player is to blame for an entire season, then that team has a much bigger problem than that coach or player. I mean, where's everyone else on the team? Shouldn't they be able to recognize these problems, if we can?

[tetoncat]

"We will see if we have a OC proof team."

What does that mean?

I'll try to explain my thought. Last year when one or other of the 2 QB were out ahead of time it seemed like game plans featured the strengths of the one playing. If both played against good teams it seemed each was more restricted on what we ran with them. And if To.my went out in game it was as if Chambers hadn't been prepped for full game plan. Hopefully without a 2 QB system the backup is fully prepared by OC to run the full plan for that week if necessary.

I'm not saying you're wrong because I certainly don't have that much knowledge about the details of an OC's job, but I'd find it hard to believe that an OC at this level running a 2QB system isn't going to prepare both QBs for a game and be able to adjust a game plan accordingly. I don't expect them to be perfect but to fail at nearly every turn in this situation is hard to fathom. Most games with Mellott available/starting, Chambers was IMO a situational player who would primarily come in for three situations: short yardage, after a big gain, or to run some type of gadget play. When he did start Mellott was typically out for the game. I think there are coaches at this level that get stubborn and stick with a system too long, but I don't think many have the problem that you're describing.

I only recall two games where Mellott was injured, and Chambers was called on to run the game solo from there. SDSU and NDSU. Neither QB had a lot of success vs SDSU, but Chambers led an amazing, gutsy drive at the end of the game. I thought both QBs had good success vs NDSU and MSU probably wins the game if Chambers isn't hurt as I think he doesn't step out of bounds and scores in regulation. He made a mistake after that and perhaps was being asked to do something he just wasn't confident doing due to his injury, but it wasn't the first time he'd made that error so in that case it's on him and not the OC.

Sports can be very random even at the highest levels and players/coaches can just have a bad game no matter how good they are. Trying to pin too much responsibility on one player or coach is good for ratings on talk shows but I don't think it's very realistic in a macro sense. Yes, Steph Curry has gone Oh-fer-10 shooting 3s and the Warriors lost those games and Curry himself will take the blame. But to blame someone for failure over an entire season (or 3 seasons) is a stretch IMHO. I've heard numerous coaches and players take the blame for games but if a coach or player is to blame for an entire season, then that team has a much bigger problem than that coach or player. I mean, where's everyone else on the team? Shouldn't they be able to recognize these problems, if we can?

You sort of make my point for me. If Chambers was the guy going into a game cats seemed diverse in passing and running. I'd both played he was situational.

Your last part of saying coach or player is to blame for whole season also ties into the full discussion here. Posts are saying the season hinges on Tommy and if he is out season is over. So in that scenario they are saying success is tied to one player so wouldn't failure also be.