The Bobcat Nation

The top two threads in this forum are on Stitt. So I figured I'd throw another log on the fire.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2614 ... e-football

tampa_griz wrote:The top two threads in this forum are on Stitt. So I figured I'd throw another log on the fire.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2614 ... e-football

Yeah, if he was truly one of the best offensive minds he wouldn't be coaching at an FCS school at his age (in his 50s). The market would have spoken loudly on that one. But I understand why they threw him into their clickbait slide show.

Hey it was on Bleacher Report. It must be true.

SonomaCat wrote:

tampa_griz wrote:The top two threads in this forum are on Stitt. So I figured I'd throw another log on the fire.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2614 ... e-football

Yeah, if he was truly one of the best offensive minds he wouldn't be coaching at an FCS school at his age (in his 50s). The market would have spoken loudly on that one. But I understand why they threw him into their clickbait slide show.

I think Jim Tressel was 50 when he was hired at Ohio State after toiling at Youngstown State for around fifteen years. So ya never know!

SonomaCat wrote:

tampa_griz wrote:The top two threads in this forum are on Stitt. So I figured I'd throw another log on the fire.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2614 ... e-football

Yeah, if he was truly one of the best offensive minds he wouldn't be coaching at an FCS school at his age (in his 50s). The market would have spoken loudly on that one. But I understand why they threw him into their clickbait slide show.

You and I agree about 95% of the time, but I'm not with you on this one. Your basic premise is that the fact that someone is at an FCS school beyond a certain age means they can't be a great offensive mind. I don't agree. People make career decisions for all kinds of reasons. I don't know why Stitt stayed at CSM for as long as he did, but the fact that he did doesn't mean he can't be a great offensive coach. Time will tell whether he's going to succeed or not at this level, but I don't think the mere fact that he hasn't yet advanced further should automatically disqualify him.

The great offensive coach had a rather pedestrian offense last year, culminating in completely being shut down by NDSU the second time they played.

PapaG wrote:The great offensive coach had a rather pedestrian offense last year, culminating in completely being shut down by NDSU the second time they played.

Yep - in his first year in a new program, with someone else's recruits, and in a year where he spent much of the season using his 3rd string qb, he had a "pedestrian" year (which included hanging 54 points on your Cats, btw). I agree.

I'm not sure how that reflects on his coaching ability - if he's still looking the same after a few more years as the Griz coach, then I might agree that this list overrated him. But as usual, your brilliant analysis is acknowledged and has been given its due attention.

Grizlaw wrote:

PapaG wrote:The great offensive coach had a rather pedestrian offense last year, culminating in completely being shut down by NDSU the second time they played.

Yep - in his first year in a new program, with someone else's recruits, and in a year where he spent much of the season using his 3rd string qb, he had a "pedestrian" year (which included hanging 54 points on your Cats, btw). I agree.

I'm not sure how that reflects on his coaching ability - if he's still looking the same after a few more years as the Griz coach, then I might agree that this list overrated him. But as usual, your brilliant analysis is acknowledged and has been given its due attention.

How did Tim Cramsey do in his first year in a new program, with someone else's recruits, as an offensive coach?

He may be the only FCS coach in my memory to be fired from his FCS job and end up at a solid mid-major FBS program in the same job.

I mean this is a freaking opinion piece from one writer at something called Bleacher Report, and Griz fans are pushing it like it actually means something.

Grizlaw wrote:

SonomaCat wrote:

tampa_griz wrote:The top two threads in this forum are on Stitt. So I figured I'd throw another log on the fire.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2614 ... e-football

Yeah, if he was truly one of the best offensive minds he wouldn't be coaching at an FCS school at his age (in his 50s). The market would have spoken loudly on that one. But I understand why they threw him into their clickbait slide show.

You and I agree about 95% of the time, but I'm not with you on this one. Your basic premise is that the fact that someone is at an FCS school beyond a certain age means they can't be a great offensive mind. I don't agree. People make career decisions for all kinds of reasons. I don't know why Stitt stayed at CSM for as long as he did, but the fact that he did doesn't mean he can't be a great offensive coach. Time will tell whether he's going to succeed or not at this level, but I don't think the mere fact that he hasn't yet advanced further should automatically disqualify him.

Sounds like you think it's possible that Stitt could be a great offensive mind at some point. I agree.
Do you think Stitt is one of the top 5 offensive minds in college football right NOW?
Also, where would you rank Cramsey on your list, above or below Stitt? Again I'm asking at this point in time, not what's possible in a few years.

Grizlaw wrote:

SonomaCat wrote:

tampa_griz wrote:The top two threads in this forum are on Stitt. So I figured I'd throw another log on the fire.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2614 ... e-football

Yeah, if he was truly one of the best offensive minds he wouldn't be coaching at an FCS school at his age (in his 50s). The market would have spoken loudly on that one. But I understand why they threw him into their clickbait slide show.

You and I agree about 95% of the time, but I'm not with you on this one. Your basic premise is that the fact that someone is at an FCS school beyond a certain age means they can't be a great offensive mind. I don't agree. People make career decisions for all kinds of reasons. I don't know why Stitt stayed at CSM for as long as he did, but the fact that he did doesn't mean he can't be a great offensive coach. Time will tell whether he's going to succeed or not at this level, but I don't think the mere fact that he hasn't yet advanced further should automatically disqualify him.

It seems quite clear that Stitt is a VERY motivated self-promoter and seeks as much fame and glory as he can achieve (which is not a bad thing at all), so if he was one of the BEST offensive minds in America (not merely a "good" or a "great" offensive mind), I have no doubt that he would have taken opportunities that were presented to him to snag one of the best jobs available.

If this was a ho-hum guy, then I'd agree that maybe he just liked the quiet life and didn't want to move up. But Stitt doesn't seem to fit that profile to me.

I think the disconnect between our posts is that you are arguing that he essentially could be a "great" offensive coach (which I agree with - that is possible ... depending on how one defines "great," I guess), while I am going off the assertion of the article that he is one of the "best" offensive minds in America.

I will also admit that there's a chance that I am wrong (that always exists), but I do feel pretty good about this one -- I just don't buy the idea that he chose to not take a big time job all these years and instead chose to work for a fraction of a fame, glory and money in D-II and FCS instead. That just doesn't seem to jive with his persona.

Grizlaw wrote:(which included hanging 54 points on your Cats, btw)

In all fairness, by that measure, almost everyone on the offensive coaching staff of almost every team we played last year was one of the best offensive minds in the country last year.

SonomaCat wrote:

Grizlaw wrote:(which included hanging 54 points on your Cats, btw)

In all fairness, by that measure, almost everyone on the offensive coaching staff of almost every team we played last year was one of the best offensive minds in the country last year.

Duplicate

PapaG wrote:

Grizlaw wrote:

PapaG wrote:The great offensive coach had a rather pedestrian offense last year, culminating in completely being shut down by NDSU the second time they played.

Yep - in his first year in a new program, with someone else's recruits, and in a year where he spent much of the season using his 3rd string qb, he had a "pedestrian" year (which included hanging 54 points on your Cats, btw). I agree.

I'm not sure how that reflects on his coaching ability - if he's still looking the same after a few more years as the Griz coach, then I might agree that this list overrated him. But as usual, your brilliant analysis is acknowledged and has been given its due attention.

How did Tim Cramsey do in his first year in a new program, with someone else's recruits, as an offensive coach?

I'm having trouble finding good information about him, but it appears to me that his first year at MSU was 2013, which would mean that in his first year he went 7-5 and got his ass handed to him by the Griz. I assume I'm missing something though, so please let me know what it is...

SonomaCat wrote:

Grizlaw wrote:(which included hanging 54 points on your Cats, btw)

In all fairness, by that measure, almost everyone on the offensive coaching staff of almost every team we played last year was one of the best offensive minds in the country last year.

Portland State's and EWU's coaches should be even higher using Grizlaw's standard.

Plus I suppose we can flip that around and say that Cramsey put up over 500 yards on a Griz defense that apparently was under the new best-ever Griz DC's control, and were a punter's flop away from perhaps making it a one score game with plenty of time left and the Griz offense struggling.

Grizlaw wrote:

PapaG wrote:

Grizlaw wrote:

PapaG wrote:The great offensive coach had a rather pedestrian offense last year, culminating in completely being shut down by NDSU the second time they played.

Yep - in his first year in a new program, with someone else's recruits, and in a year where he spent much of the season using his 3rd string qb, he had a "pedestrian" year (which included hanging 54 points on your Cats, btw). I agree.

I'm not sure how that reflects on his coaching ability - if he's still looking the same after a few more years as the Griz coach, then I might agree that this list overrated him. But as usual, your brilliant analysis is acknowledged and has been given its due attention.

How did Tim Cramsey do in his first year in a new program, with someone else's recruits, as an offensive coach?

I'm having trouble finding good information about him, but it appears to me that his first year at MSU was 2013, which would mean that in his first year he went 7-5 and got his ass handed to him by the Griz. I assume I'm missing something though, so please let me know what it is...

I'm pretty sure that the reason Stitt has been hailed a a brilliant offensive mind is because CSM is as hard to get into as Harvard, so he had to work with 200 lb offensive linemen and WRs that run sub 6.0 40s.

onceacat wrote: I'm pretty sure that the reason Stitt has been hailed a a brilliant offensive mind is because CSM is as hard to get into as Harvard, so he had to work with 200 lb offensive linemen and WRs that run sub 6.0 40s.

Maybe, although I think that bowl game where West Virginia adopted some of his schemes and their coach gave him a shout out after the game helped him, too. Nobody has heard of him before that. Don Read had a similar moment in 1994 or 1995, when Lou Holtz adopted his offense and used it to beat Florida State in a bowl game, and that helped his reputation as well.

I don't know how Stitt will do over the next few years, to be honest. Maybe he belongs on this list, and maybe he doesn't. I was mainly just disagreeing with the idea that him being an FCS coach should automatically disqualify him. The fact that he hasn't moved up doesn't necessarily mean he couldn't have.

As a sidenote - one guy I noticed who wasn't on the list was Dino Babers (head coach of Syracuse, who just moved there from Bowling Green). He runs the same basic offense that Stitt runs, and he had the #1 passing offense and a top-5 total offense in FBS this year. He probably deserves to be on the list more than Stitt does, but they run the same offense, so...

Stitt has a good offensive mind. I don't think there's any questioning that. Apparently not everyone agrees, because he's still a FCS coach, but most FBS coaches start out as assistants in the FBS. Stitt has had to take the long route. BR has basically been lobbying for Stitt to get a FBS job ever since he got to Montana. They mentioned him as a top candidate for the Iowa State job and one other FBS job last fall. I kind of wonder if the writer doesn't have some connection to him.

Stitt has been saying that his system will work at any level for a few years now. We'll found out soon. I would think if he's got "it" he'll have UM in the top three in scoring and total offense by this next season.

Stitt's main problem will be how young his team is overall and especially at WR. He only has 27 juniors and seniors on the team and of those two just transferred in. 13 of them got considerable playing time, but two of those were filling in for injured starters. So half the starters will be new and several of the returning starters only started parts of the season, but the offense overall is fairly experienced with most of the OL returning along with Horner, Gustafson and Nguyen. He has 77 true frosh/RS frosh/sophomores on the team. Very few backups have game experience. The real sore spot is at WR where he has just one senior (a transfer) and one junior. The rest are sophomores (3) and freshmen (12). They only return four WRs that caught passes last season. A total of 38 receptions for 453 yards and one TD. 22-294-1 came from Horner. I think the Calhoun kid could be a player for them, but that's a very young, inexperienced group for a team that lives by the pass.

They lost Henderson, Jones and Roberts. Henderson and Jones were elite FCS WRs and UM wasn't one of the top offenses in the BSC with them. Also keep in mind that Gustafson only had a passer rating of 122.5 and he's not a mobile QB by today's standards with just 76 yards gained last year. Their run game only average 3.6 per carry despite there being an 'element-of-surprise' whenever they did run.

Henderson will be back....

Helcat72 wrote:Henderson will be back....

????

He left school and declared for the draft. Even if he came back. He would be ineligible this fall.