Best FCS teams of all time

[[cat_bracket]]

GSU 6 titles
YSU 4. Beat um twice in playoffs.
App St 3
UM 2 with lots of appearances. Beat ASU twice in playoffs.

NDSU seems primed to join the list. EKU was good back in the day. Marshall is right up there. I'd probably put Marshall in fifth behind UM, but that beat down they put on the grizz was an all timer and you could make a good case that they're fourth.

[gtapp]

That looks good if you mean best programs. One of the best teams ever was the Marshall team with Randy Moss. That was an unbeatable team!

[AlphaGriz1]

Bruno Mars

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2

[El Griz]

'96 Marshall team. They took a very good Griz team to the woodshed. Many pro's from that team, even backup players.

[Grizlaw]

'96 Marshall team. They took a very good Griz team to the woodshed. Many pro's from that team, even backup players.

Agreed.

To me, "best team" means something different than "best program." I think the 1996 Marshall team is the most dominant I-AA / FCS team ever. The 1996 Griz team (which didn't win the title, but would have almost any other year) is probably also in the top 5, as is the 1995 Griz team.

If you're talking best program, I think the original post is pretty much right. I think you also have to add Marshall to the mix, though (with two titles and four losses in title games, they're as worthy of mention as UM is).

[09griz]

(Something a put together last year. I only included the last quarter century...)

For me it's between App. State, Montana, Georgia Southern & Youngstown State


There are countless things to look at but I believe there are 4 categories that are critical.


-First and foremost National Championships.

National Championships-Runner Ups-Total Appearances

Georgia Southern 5- 2- 7
Youngstown St. 4- 2- 6
Appalachian St. 3- 0- 3
Montana 2- 5- 7


All three beat UM in this category but Montana's tied with GS for amount of appearances.


-The next thing I'd look at is total wins in the last 25 years.

Montana 266
Georgia Southern 243
Appalachian State 233
Youngstown State 204

Montana wins this one.


-Now we will look at total Playoff appearances and winning pct.
Playoff appearances-PCT.
Montana 21- .627
Appalachian State 19- .600
Georgia Southern 18- . 782
Youngstown State 11- .781

Montana has the most playoff births but Georgia Southern and Youngstown State have the best winning % in the playoffs.


-Conference championships in the last 25 years.

Montana 16
App. State 11
Georgia Southern 9
Youngstown State 3

Montana has a lead in this category as well.


Though Montana and Appalachian state are the two winningest teams of the last 10 years, when you look back 25 years an argument can be made who is the best. Georgia Southern has the most titles yet Montana ties them for appearances and has more wins in the last 25 years. Montana has the most playoff appearances but Youngstown State and Georgia Southern have a better winning PCT. in them. Montana is the most consistent team year in and year out of the last 25 years.

Admittedly a slight touch biased I'll say;

#1 Montana

The consistency of this program is unparalleled and though we've fallen on the wrong side of the coin more then Georgia Southern in the title games we have powerful numbers in other aspects (most overall wins, most playoff births, most conference titles) that I feel put the Griz on top.

#2 Georgia Southern

Sporting an impressive amount of national championships and an excellent winning pct. in the playoffs I put GS 2nd because they lack the consistency UM has shown in the last 25 years. They have less overall wins, less playoff births and less conference titles.

#3 Appalacian State

An insane run from 05-07 with more then impressive playoff numbers put App. on the list with the greatest. App. is on Montana's ass in total playoff appearances but they will need to get a few more W's to catch Montana's PCT. App. is far behind Montana but closing in on GS for total wins. With 11 conference titles they only fall to Montana in this category. Montana is leading the series 2-1 with the '09 game raking in the highest rating ever for an FCS game.

#4 Youngstown State

Youngstown States powerhouse rein in the 90's raking in 4 titles and two runner ups got them on the list with the greatest. Sporting two playoff appearances in the last decade it's not looking good for Youngstown's chances at becoming dominate again any time soon. Youngstown came in last in total wins with 204 and last in playoff appearances with 11. They also came in last in conference titles with 3.


Honorable mentions:

Eastern Kentucky
Delaware
Furman
McNeese State
Northern Iowa

[BLACKnBLUEnGOLD]

"Conference championships in the past 25 years."

Cherry-pick much there, Mr. Slight Touch of Bias? Why not 10 or 50 or all time?

[Grizlaw]

"Conference championships in the past 25 years."

Cherry-pick much there, Mr. Slight Touch of Bias? Why not 10 or 50 or all time?

I-AA football has only been in existence for 35 years. If you think adding the first ten years of history would change his analysis that much, then maybe you should do the research and make the argument instead of just taking pot shots...

[cats2506]

"Conference championships in the past 25 years."

Cherry-pick much there, Mr. Slight Touch of Bias? Why not 10 or 50 or all time?

I-AA football has only been in existence for 35 years. If you think adding the first ten years of history would change his analysis that much, then maybe you should do the research and make the argument instead of just taking pot shots...

But what reason would there be to leave out the first 10 years then?

[BLACKnBLUEnGOLD]

"Conference championships in the past 25 years."

Cherry-pick much there, Mr. Slight Touch of Bias? Why not 10 or 50 or all time?

I-AA football has only been in existence for 35 years. If you think adding the first ten years of history would change his analysis that much, then maybe you should do the research and make the argument instead of just taking pot shots...

My burning hatred for research is the sole reason I'm not a grad student right now. Not everyone's a lawyer. And it's not like most or all of those teams haven't all been around for at least 50 years. Just because there wasn't a such thing as I-AA football then doesn't make that part of those programs' histories meaningless.

[Grizlaw]

I-AA football has only been in existence for 35 years. If you think adding the first ten years of history would change his analysis that much, then maybe you should do the research and make the argument instead of just taking pot shots...

But what reason would there be to leave out the first 10 years then?[/quote]

Maybe there isn't one. Maybe he should've used 35 instead of 25. Like I said, if you think it really changes the list, feel free to make the argument. I don't think it does, though. At the end of the day, GSU still has six titles, YSU has 4, App has 3, UM and Marshall have 2 (each with 4-5 runner-up finishes). I don't think anything happened in the first ten years that would change the list at all, but if you disagree, feel free to make the argument.

[Grizlaw]

My burning hatred for research is the sole reason I'm not a grad student right now. Not everyone's a lawyer. And it's not like most or all of those teams haven't all been around for at least 50 years. Just because there wasn't a such thing as I-AA football then doesn't make that part of those programs' histories meaningless.

Ahh yes, the "lawyer" argument. I didn't know you had to be a lawyer to argue about football.

Sure, all of these schools have been around for 100 years or more, and most of them have football programs that are almost that old. If someone started a thread titled "Which of these schools has the strongest football program over the entire history of their programs," it might make sense to go back to the beginning of time. But in a thread titled "Best FCS teams of all time," doesn't it kind of make sense to focus on...well, the history of FCS football?

[Weltercat]

I think including the first 10 years makes a big difference not just because of the number of titles a team won but the strength of the Div1AA. by the mid nineties the FCS or Div1AA had lost a good share of it's teams to the FBS. When BSU won in 1980, ISU won in 1981 or even the cats in 1984 the FBS was a much stronger league. I would argue that the 76 div II championship the cats won was against better competition that some of the latter years of the fcs. There is a pretty good argument to be made about EKU being the best Div1AA team of all time in my mind.

[BLACKnBLUEnGOLD]

My burning hatred for research is the sole reason I'm not a grad student right now. Not everyone's a lawyer. And it's not like most or all of those teams haven't all been around for at least 50 years. Just because there wasn't a such thing as I-AA football then doesn't make that part of those programs' histories meaningless.

Ahh yes, the "lawyer" argument. I didn't know you had to be a lawyer to argue about football.

Sure, all of these schools have been around for 100 years or more, and most of them have football programs that are almost that old. If someone started a thread titled "Which of these schools has the strongest football program over the entire history of their programs," it might make sense to go back to the beginning of time. But in a thread titled "Best FCS teams of all time," doesn't it kind of make sense to focus on...well, the history of FCS football?

No, but as a lawyer, you're more likely to assume that people don't consider "research" the dirtiest word in the dictionary. (It's only third for me now that they added "frienemy," which may be the single stupidest word ever invented.)

The title is ambiguous. If it just said "best FCS team," it would suggest that the argument is about which team is the best in Division I-AA right now. That would obviously be NDSU. If it said "best team in FCS history" it would probably suggest what you're saying, a discussion about the history of I-AA football (or, alternately, a discussion of that level of football since the stupid new acronyms were introduced, but obviously that would be a stupid discussion). But I think to make an argument about "all time" at least implies that we're actually talking about ALL TIME, and not just the past 35 years, and that to intentionally limit a larger sample to 25 years in a discussion about "all time" is disingenuous enough to rate a mention.

[Grizlaw]

I think including the first 10 years makes a big difference not just because of the number of titles a team won but the strength of the Div1AA. by the mid nineties the FCS or Div1AA had lost a good share of it's teams to the FBS. When BSU won in 1980, ISU won in 1981 or even the cats in 1984 the FBS was a much stronger league. I would argue that the 76 div II championship the cats won was against better competition that some of the latter years of the fcs. There is a pretty good argument to be made about EKU being the best Div1AA team of all time in my mind.

If you look at the first ten years worth of national title games in I-AA, you'll see that only two of the first ten champions are no longer in FCS: Boise State (which moved up in 1996), and Northeast Louisiana (now Louisiana-Monroe, which moved up in 1989).

If you look at the runners-up from those years, you'll see that four of them have moved up: UMass (which didn't move until 2012), Louisiana Tech (which left in 1989), Arkansas State (1987), and Marshall (1997).

Nevada-Reno left in 1992; however, as they never made a title game appearance, I think it's hard to argue that their departure significantly diluted the division (though they were a regular BSC contender).

So it looks to me like the only top teams that left I-AA prior to the mid 90's were Northeast Louisiana, Arkansas State, and Louisiana Tech. Do you really think the departures of those three schools (who had one title and three title game appearances between them) diluted the division that much? Or are there other schools that I'm missing?

[Grizlaw]

No, but as a lawyer, you're more likely to assume that people don't consider "research" the dirtiest word in the dictionary. (It's only third for me now that they added "frienemy," which may be the single stupidest word ever invented.)

Fair enough, but it's not like we're debating Constitutional legislative intent here. Researching college football history isn't that painful, is it?

[Weltercat]

I think including the first 10 years makes a big difference not just because of the number of titles a team won but the strength of the Div1AA. by the mid nineties the FCS or Div1AA had lost a good share of it's teams to the FBS. When BSU won in 1980, ISU won in 1981 or even the cats in 1984 the FBS was a much stronger league. I would argue that the 76 div II championship the cats won was against better competition that some of the latter years of the fcs. There is a pretty good argument to be made about EKU being the best Div1AA team of all time in my mind.

If you look at the first ten years worth of national title games in I-AA, you'll see that only two of the first ten champions are no longer in FCS: Boise State (which moved up in 1996), and Northeast Louisiana (now Louisiana-Monroe, which moved up in 1989).

If you look at the runners-up from those years, you'll see that four of them have moved up: UMass (which didn't move until 2012), Louisiana Tech (which left in 1989), Arkansas State (1987), and Marshall (1997).

Nevada-Reno left in 1992; however, as they never made a title game appearance, I think it's hard to argue that their departure significantly diluted the division (though they were a regular BSC contender).

So it looks to me like the only top teams that left I-AA prior to the mid 90's were Northeast Louisiana, Arkansas State, and Louisiana Tech. Do you really think the departures of those three schools (who had one title and three title game appearances between them) diluted the division that much? Or are there other schools that I'm missing?

Three schools huh! just because a team didn't make the championship game doesn't mean they didn't make noise in the playoffs and add to the competition. I know football was invented in the early nineties to most around here but what about teams like Idaho, North Texas, Western Kentucky, Connecticut, Central Florida and on and on...

[[cat_bracket]]

(Something a put together last year. I only included the last quarter century...)

For me it's between App. State, Montana, Georgia Southern & Youngstown State


There are countless things to look at but I believe there are 4 categories that are critical.


-First and foremost National Championships.

National Championships-Runner Ups-Total Appearances

Georgia Southern 5- 2- 7
Youngstown St. 4- 2- 6
Appalachian St. 3- 0- 3
Montana 2- 5- 7


All three beat UM in this category but Montana's tied with GS for amount of appearances.


-The next thing I'd look at is total wins in the last 25 years.

Montana 266
Georgia Southern 243
Appalachian State 233
Youngstown State 204

Montana wins this one.


-Now we will look at total Playoff appearances and winning pct.
Playoff appearances-PCT.
Montana 21- .627
Appalachian State 19- .600
Georgia Southern 18- . 782
Youngstown State 11- .781

Montana has the most playoff births but Georgia Southern and Youngstown State have the best winning % in the playoffs.


-Conference championships in the last 25 years.

Montana 16
App. State 11
Georgia Southern 9
Youngstown State 3

Montana has a lead in this category as well.


Though Montana and Appalachian state are the two winningest teams of the last 10 years, when you look back 25 years an argument can be made who is the best. Georgia Southern has the most titles yet Montana ties them for appearances and has more wins in the last 25 years. Montana has the most playoff appearances but Youngstown State and Georgia Southern have a better winning PCT. in them. Montana is the most consistent team year in and year out of the last 25 years.

Admittedly a slight touch biased I'll say;

#1 Montana

The consistency of this program is unparalleled and though we've fallen on the wrong side of the coin more then Georgia Southern in the title games we have powerful numbers in other aspects (most overall wins, most playoff births, most conference titles) that I feel put the Griz on top.

#2 Georgia Southern

Sporting an impressive amount of national championships and an excellent winning pct. in the playoffs I put GS 2nd because they lack the consistency UM has shown in the last 25 years. They have less overall wins, less playoff births and less conference titles.

#3 Appalacian State

An insane run from 05-07 with more then impressive playoff numbers put App. on the list with the greatest. App. is on Montana's ass in total playoff appearances but they will need to get a few more W's to catch Montana's PCT. App. is far behind Montana but closing in on GS for total wins. With 11 conference titles they only fall to Montana in this category. Montana is leading the series 2-1 with the '09 game raking in the highest rating ever for an FCS game.

#4 Youngstown State

Youngstown States powerhouse rein in the 90's raking in 4 titles and two runner ups got them on the list with the greatest. Sporting two playoff appearances in the last decade it's not looking good for Youngstown's chances at becoming dominate again any time soon. Youngstown came in last in total wins with 204 and last in playoff appearances with 11. They also came in last in conference titles with 3.


Honorable mentions:

Eastern Kentucky
Delaware
Furman
McNeese State
Northern Iowa

If you're admitting you have a bias then just remove yourself from the discussion.

[cats2506]

But what reason would there be to leave out the first 10 years then?

Maybe there isn't one. Maybe he should've used 35 instead of 25. Like I said, if you think it really changes the list, feel free to make the argument. I don't think it does, though. At the end of the day, GSU still has six titles, YSU has 4, App has 3, UM and Marshall have 2 (each with 4-5 runner-up finishes). I don't think anything happened in the first ten years that would change the list at all, but if you disagree, feel free to make the argument.

there is absolutely no valid reason at all to leave off those years, you are pulling an arbitrary subset of the data, the only logical explanation would be that they one doing it is a griz fan that obviously believe that the epoch of all things football is 1985. In leaving off those years it shows an inherent bias in the data.

[Grizlaw]

Three schools huh! just because a team didn't make the championship game doesn't mean they didn't make noise in the playoffs and add to the competition. I know football was invented in the early nineties to most around here but what about teams like Idaho, North Texas, Western Kentucky, Connecticut, Central Florida and on and on...

North Texas moved up in 1995, which means they were I-AA from 1978-1994. Here was their record during those years:

1978: 9-2
1979: 5-6
1980: 6-5
1981: 2-9
1982: 2-9
1983: 8-4
1984: 2-9
1985: 4-6-1
1986: 6-4
1987: 7-5
1988: 8-4
1989: 5-6
1990: 6-5
1991: 3-7-1
1992: 5-6
1993: 4-7
1994: 7-4-1

So you think their exit diminished I-AA?

Idaho moved up in 1996.

Western Kentucky moved up in 2009.

UConn moved up in 2000-2001.

UCF moved up in 1996, but did not move up to I-AA until 1990 (and thus, was not a part of the division during the first ten years, when you say that the division was "stronger.")