2008 griz team discussion

[catatac]

I am not trying to smack the griz here, just posting my opinions. I wanted to post my thoughts on the griz, trying to justify why I am picking them 3rd or 4th in the conference next season. I know the griz have really been more in a “reload” rather than “rebuild” mode for the past few years, but when you look at the list of who they are losing next year… it is a huge loss of talent. I don’t ever remember seeing any Big Sky team lose that many star players at once. Of course Bobby (If he's still there... if he bolts then things really get interesting for the Griz) will recruit more great players and other players will step up and the griz will be good again… but unless they reconstruct their offensive philosophy and find a better way to utilize their talent, I think they will struggle early on… if not for the entire season. That is why I picked them 3rd or 4th in the Big Sky. I don’t think Bobby has it in him to seriously look at their deficiency on O and fire his buddy RP. They won several close games this season due to their awesome defense, their kicker, and Lex carrying the load at the end. (Hilliard and Carpenter are both NFL caliber players BTW) They lose most of their playmakers on D, their kicker, and Lex. I think they out-talented several teams despite the offensive scheme that apparently takes a few years to learn and master, yet still doesn’t work that will with a veteran team. If you look at the list of seniors they lose, and this is not counting other players they lose due to arrests, it is pretty dramatic. If you take a look at the 2007 Grizzly team as a whole, and pick the 20 best players on the team… I guarantee you that at least 15 of them are in this list. Bergquist, Anderson, Ferriter, possibly Quinn (talented, but still a POS in my view)… are examples of great players coming back… but they will have so many new players to break in it will be interesting to watch. One other point on this, I don’t know how many all conference 1st and 2nd team players they lose, but it has to be some sort of record as well.

5 Allen, Eric SR WR 6' 3" 205 lbs. Colorado Springs, CO
3 Bagley, Ryan SR WR 6' 4" 219 lbs. Great Falls, MT
71 Balogh, Cody SR OT 6' 7" 328 lbs. Steilacoom, WA
53 Biermann, Kroy SR DE 6' 3" 241 lbs. Hardin, MT
20 Bradshaw, Reggie SR RB 6' 0" 216 lbs. Coquitlam, B.C.
44 Brown, Jesse SR S 5' 11" 193 lbs. Bozeman, MT
29 Carpenter, Dan SR K/P 6' 2" 207 lbs. Helena, MT
2 Chambers, Craig SR WR 6' 4" 196 lbs. Mill Creek, WA
21 Clark, Chris SR CB 5' 11" 156 lbs. Los Angeles, CA
40 Coleman, Greg JR RB 6' 0" 239 lbs. Peoria, IL
17 Cooper Jr., Van SR S 6' 2" 205 lbs. Denver, CO
4 Foreman, Muckie SR LB 6' 1" 215 lbs. Spanaway, WA
74 Gustafson, Ryan SR OL 6' 5" 277 lbs. Billings, MT
43 Hawthorne, Alex SR LB 6' 2" 249 lbs. Mesa, AZ
38 Hilliard, Lex SR RB 6' 0" 240 lbs. Kalispell, MT
34 Jackson, Quinton SR CB 5' 11" 178 lbs. Seattle, WA
26 Johnson, Tyson SR P 6' 2" 189 lbs. Stevensville, MT
6 Joyce, Tyler SR LB 6' 5" 224 lbs. Aurora, CO
59 Kain, Kelly SR DT 6' 4" 281 lbs. Great Falls, MT
78 Michel, Eric SR OG 6' 6" 280 lbs. Billings, MT
46 Ryan, Kyle SR LB 6' 3" 228 lbs. Billings, MT
32 Thomas, Torrey SR S 6' 0" 194 lbs. Dillon, MT
37 Utterback, Loren SR LB 6' 2" 215 lbs. Fort Benton, MT

[SonomaCat]

At the expense of pouring a little gas on the fire, what are the odds that Quinn can stay out of trouble for an entire year and be in uniform for the Griz next year? I just have a bad feeling that he is lit fuse that will blow up at some point, judging by his consistently bad decisions and his seeming lack of a sense of accountability each time he speaks.

That said, I hope he's found his way, so to speak, and has put his past attitude behind him.

[catatac]

Wow. You read my mind. I almost included an (If he's still on the team) after I typed his name. That late hit he had on Saturday pretty much summed up what kind of person\player he is, in my opinion.

[Cat-theotherwhitemeat]

The one thing I love about this team is their depth. I think they'll have plenty of talent. However, if Hauck is still the coach and Phen is still the OC, then I agree with you, 3rd or 4th. If it's Mike Van Diest, then I think the Griz have the talent and the coaching staff to rip things up.

[STREETCAT]

The one thing I love about this team is their depth. I think they'll have plenty of talent. However, if Hauck is still the coach and Phen is still the OC, then I agree with you, 3rd or 4th. If it's Mike Van Diest, then I think the Griz have the talent and the coaching staff to rip things up.

I question THE MVD as HC. I think there would be way more quilified coaches though out the country that would be chompin at the bit to get in the drivers seat of the Griz program! What take an NAIA HC over a Good BCS OC OR DC, or even a Good HC from FCS?

[SonomaCat]

The one thing I love about this team is their depth. I think they'll have plenty of talent. However, if Hauck is still the coach and Phen is still the OC, then I agree with you, 3rd or 4th. If it's Mike Van Diest, then I think the Griz have the talent and the coaching staff to rip things up.

I question THE MVD as HC. I think there would be way more quilified coaches though out the country that would be chompin at the bit to get in the drivers seat of the Griz program! What take an NAIA HC over a Good BCS OC OR DC, or even a Good HC from FCS?

I'd love to see MVD get a shot with UM. We've heard all sorts of speculation running the range from "He'd fail miserably at this level" to "He'd be a messiah," and it would be really interesting to see exactly how well he could do in 1-AA. Is coaching that much different between NAIA and 1-AA? I really have no idea, but I'd be really interested to see how it would play out.

The downside right now is that any coach that steps into the position won't have the talent ready to go that Hauck had this year (they will be down at least a little, and maybe quite a bit), so it won't be a straight apples to apples comparison right away. But after a few years, one should get a pretty good idea as to how well he was able to do on his own merits.

[STREETCAT]

The one thing I love about this team is their depth. I think they'll have plenty of talent. However, if Hauck is still the coach and Phen is still the OC, then I agree with you, 3rd or 4th. If it's Mike Van Diest, then I think the Griz have the talent and the coaching staff to rip things up.

I question THE MVD as HC. I think there would be way more quilified coaches though out the country that would be chompin at the bit to get in the drivers seat of the Griz program! What take an NAIA HC over a Good BCS OC OR DC, or even a Good HC from FCS?

I'd love to see MVD get a shot with UM. We've heard all sorts of speculation running the range from "He'd fail miserably at this level" to "He'd be a messiah," and it would be really interesting to see exactly how well he could do in 1-AA. Is coaching that much different between NAIA and 1-AA? I really have no idea, but I'd be really interested to see how it would play out.

The downside right now is that any coach that steps into the position won't have the talent ready to go that Hauck had this year (they will be down at least a little, and maybe quite a bit), so it won't be a straight apples to apples comparison right away. But after a few years, one should get a pretty good idea as to how well he was able to do on his own merits.

But you know how the "MECCA" down the road like the W's!! I could imagine an uproar if they lost 3 games!

[duelalumnicat]

Bay Area Cat, I also thought the same exact thing when I saw Quinn's blatant cheap shot late hit.

[Cat-theotherwhitemeat]

The one thing I love about this team is their depth. I think they'll have plenty of talent. However, if Hauck is still the coach and Phen is still the OC, then I agree with you, 3rd or 4th. If it's Mike Van Diest, then I think the Griz have the talent and the coaching staff to rip things up.

I question THE MVD as HC. I think there would be way more quilified coaches though out the country that would be chompin at the bit to get in the drivers seat of the Griz program! What take an NAIA HC over a Good BCS OC OR DC, or even a Good HC from FCS?

4 National Championships and possible one more would qualify him, I would think. Plus, I love how his Carroll teams play. They play to win and he always seems to get the most out of his players. Something I don't think you can say about Hauck. Plus, he's a UM guy.

[SonomaCat]

Bay Area Cat, I also thought the same exact thing when I saw Quinn's blatant cheap shot late hit.

I actually didn't even see the hit ... was it pretty bad?

I am mostly going off his off-the-field activities and comments of the past couple years.

[duelalumnicat]

The late hit was blatant, though it probably looked worse than it was on the replay. Typical deal. Hilliard or whoever was down, the play is over, and suddenly Quinn just blasts some smaller Wofford guy who is just standing there next to the pile of players.

[crazycat]

The one thing I love about this team is their depth. I think they'll have plenty of talent. However, if Hauck is still the coach and Phen is still the OC, then I agree with you, 3rd or 4th. If it's Mike Van Diest, then I think the Griz have the talent and the coaching staff to rip things up.

I question THE MVD as HC. I think there would be way more quilified coaches though out the country that would be chompin at the bit to get in the drivers seat of the Griz program! What take an NAIA HC over a Good BCS OC OR DC, or even a Good HC from FCS?

I'd love to see MVD get a shot with UM. We've heard all sorts of speculation running the range from "He'd fail miserably at this level" to "He'd be a messiah," and it would be really interesting to see exactly how well he could do in 1-AA. Is coaching that much different between NAIA and 1-AA? I really have no idea, but I'd be really interested to see how it would play out.

The downside right now is that any coach that steps into the position won't have the talent ready to go that Hauck had this year (they will be down at least a little, and maybe quite a bit), so it won't be a straight apples to apples comparison right away. But after a few years, one should get a pretty good idea as to how well he was able to do on his own merits.

I don't think Van Diest will get the UM if he puts in. His offense has been very lackluster without Tyler Emmert at QB. He is a great defensive coach, but would have to bring in someone to run the offense. I don't think that will go over well at UM. I think IF they need to hire a new coach they will go looking for someone with a prolific offense.

I just don't know why anyone would take Hauck. He's been in so much trouble the past year that I'd think when it comes down to four finalists that he'd get run out by the boosters. No team wants to bring in a guy with all the baggage Hauck has. He was also in cahoots with Neuheisel. There are just too many negatives to cancel out his positives.

[SonomaCat]

I think a lot of win-starved lower I-A programs would look at Hauck's win/loss record and see all they need to see.

I do agree that the arrests of the last year have seriously tarnished his image and could really hurt him as he looks for jobs this year. And if he comes up empty this year, he could be a little screwed, as the Griz could be down a bit next year. Nobody wants to hire a smaller school coach when they are trending downward.

He may become a victim of his own success next year if he doesn't find a good job this year.

[Cledus]

I think a lot of win-starved lower I-A programs would look at Hauck's win/loss record and see all they need to see.

I do agree that the arrests of the last year have seriously tarnished his image and could really hurt him as he looks for jobs this year. And if he comes up empty this year, he could be a little screwed, as the Griz could be down a bit next year. Nobody wants to hire a smaller school coach when they are trending downward.

He may become a victim of his own success next year if he doesn't find a good job this year.

I came to that conclusion two years ago after he was passed over for the San Diego State job, quite possibly one of the worst programs in all of I-A. As long as he doesn't go to Arizona, I'm happy! As long as he doesn't go to any Pac-10 team I'll be happy as a clam.

As a little aside, Tressel never had any I-A head coaching experience before taking over at Ohio State. He moved up after a successful run at Youngstown. Which leads into my point that perhaps it's possible the Hauck tries throwing his name into the mix for the Michigan job.

Obviously, there are some differences. But there are also some similarities. Notably, both programs have internal momentum. He wouldn't need to rebuild the Michigan program, just maintain it. He's done a good job of that (for the most part) while in Missoula.

Anyways, just thought I'd throw that out there.

[BozoneCat]

Bobby Hauck would get laughed out of Ann Arbor if he even applied for the Michigan job. That is one of the top 5 college jobs in the country, and Michigan will be looking for a big name to take over. You don't go from Les Miles to Bobby Hauck unless about 100 other people turn the job down.

Tressel is a totally different story. He had been coaching at Youngstown forever, and had won 4 national championships. Not to mention, he did all of this in the state of Ohio. I think that qualifies for far different circumstances.

[FiveApples]

I came to that conclusion two years ago after he was passed over for the San Diego State job, quite possibly one of the worst programs in all of I-A. As long as he doesn't go to Arizona, I'm happy! As long as he doesn't go to any Pac-10 team I'll be happy as a clam.

As a little aside, Tressel never had any I-A head coaching experience before taking over at Ohio State. He moved up after a successful run at Youngstown. Which leads into my point that perhaps it's possible the Hauck tries throwing his name into the mix for the Michigan job.

Obviously, there are some differences. But there are also some similarities. Notably, both programs have internal momentum. He wouldn't need to rebuild the Michigan program, just maintain it. He's done a good job of that (for the most part) while in Missoula.

Anyways, just thought I'd throw that out there.

Sounds reasonable to me, although if he wants Arizona, he can have Arizona.

[GFCAT]

If Hauck leaves, then what about a Bill Cockhill reunion in Mizzou??? I see he just got fired at Wyoming as OC. I remember his offenses at Montana being wide open and explosive. What does anyone think?

[BWahlberg]

If Hauck leaves, then what about a Bill Cockhill reunion in Mizzou??? I see he just got fired at Wyoming as OC. I remember his offenses at Montana being wide open and explosive. What does anyone think?

He'd be a great OC possibility, not sure if he's HC material though. Thinking back to the 1999 McNeese loss when he went nuts and trashed the coaches booth (allegedly).

[BWahlberg]

To save a bunch of quoting I thought I'd chime in on my thoughts.

Next year will be interesting, as catatac mentions we've lost a lot of our playmakers. However this a lot of hope, on offense while we lose our best player in Lex we only lose three/four other starters. I say three/four b/c Bagley was a starter before his injury, but we lose Cody Balogh, Eric Allen and Lex. We return our QB, 4 of our OL starters, and our best WR in Mike Ferriter and two rising stars in Marani and Schulte.

The big unknown is RB. As Thomas Brooks-Fletcher needs to improve a lot of his game (blocking and catching) if he wants to be the starter. Greg Coleman was that option, but we all know where he is now.

On defense since the coaches rotated starters we'll actually have 2 safties that will be great, Colt Anderson and Shann Schillenger. 2 corners with a lot of time of the field, Olsen and Campbell and 2 other transfer corners that redshirted this year, Vandenberg and Smith. So we'll be good in pass coverage. Our interior DL will be strong, we'll have 3 seniors there, and we return 2 of the 3 DE's that played this year, unfortunatley the best one (Kroy) is gone.

LB is the total unknown. We've got Lebsock returning from a medical redshirt, he split-started the year before. And Corwin will be back, other than that we'll be looking at special teams standouts like Severin Campbell, Tom Martin and Andy Gonzales.

I see this team as having the potential to "reload" but it won't be nearly as dominant as it has been the last 2 years.

[technoCat]

I was just wondering: I saw that Chambers is on the list of people UM losing. Didn't he get a medical redshirt this year. I'm pretty sure he never played in a game.