Careless Football

[RobertoGato]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

[GoldstoneCat]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

[RobertoGato]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Yes, they could change the rotation. What I mean is that it's outside their power to change the personnel. And I don't believe they have a guy right now outside of Andersen who they could give the ball to every play and win consistently. Had they been doing that with Rovig, they would have two more losses in my opinion-- CP and NAU.

It's especially hard to just roll with Rovig right now when Ifanse and Jones are banged up. That means that your backfield most of the time will be Rovig and Perry. That's not getting it done against better teams.

Unless Rovig comes out of the bye much improved, they will be hunting a transfer at QB again in the off-season. I continue to believe that the best version of the Cats in 2019 is the one where Andersen just takes it back over and we become a team that runs the ball, plays good defense, and avoids mistakes.

[GoldstoneCat]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Yes, they could change the rotation. What I mean is that it's outside their power to change the personnel. And I don't believe they have a guy right now outside of Andersen who they could give the ball to every play and win consistently. Had they been doing that with Rovig, they would have two more losses in my opinion-- CP and NAU.

It's especially hard to just roll with Rovig right now when Ifanse and Jones are banged up. That means that your backfield most of the time will be Rovig and Perry. That's not getting it done against better teams.

Unless Rovig comes out of the bye much improved, they will be hunting a transfer at QB again in the off-season. I continue to believe that the best version of the Cats in 2019 is the one where Andersen just takes it back over and we become a team that runs the ball, plays good defense, and avoids mistakes.

Good point about the banged-up backs. I concur with your assessment of how we should go. Andersen/jonsen, take care of the ball and grind the clock.

[FTG247365]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

[RobertoGato]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

[TomCat88]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Agree with all of this and would add:

SEMO: that PF with no time before half. 17-0.

WIU: not to mention two holds during returns cost 14 points.

Norfolk: four straight first downs on four plays and bad snap* puts MSU in second and 14 and leads to punt that nets 14 yards.

CP: between the punt and INT there’s a PF.

SAC: no one blocked one of the best pass rushers in the country (99) and he unabatedly sacks Rovig on third n five before short punt.

*There have been multiple poor snaps in every game.

[technoCat]

As RG mentioned above, we were able to move the ball pretty well as evidenced by our yards gained. We just didn't seem to combine the plays correctly or execute well when the box shrunk(red zone). I think this is a game MM can learn from. Maybe next time we don't run the ball up the middle on first down when we are trying to make a come back and the QB is in rhythm. Maybe we let Troy just run it 4 times from the 3 instead of going under center, which we never do(and you can't convince me having a healthy Ifanse in that situation doesn't change things). As futile as it felt watching us at times on offense, we were in position to score at least another 13-20 points and the coaches can point to just one guy not doing their job costing us plays in big situations.

And lets not forget the defense. The offense has gotten nearly all the criticism that I have seen so far but you can't give up 10/12 third downs(including several third and long) and not take a significant amount of the blame. SSU was calling great play combinations, I don't want to not give them credit but we missed some tackles and were just plain out of position on several of those and just 1 or 2 more stops might mean we can get back in this game.

I hate to say it because the next two weeks will suck but they probably needed to be taken down a notch. Now they can sit with that feeling and hopefully channel it into better focus for the home stretch.

[catscat]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

I respectfully disagree. Doesn't matter what back is in the backfield with Jonsen. Ninety (or more) percent of the time he will run it up the middle. The way you increase his effectiveness is for him to hand it off more often. Perhaps ala the fly sweep Jones scored on. Also, why keep Rovig on the field when Jonsen or Andersen is in the wild cat formation. So far, every time it's been a run. Take him out and put in another blocker.

[grizzh8r]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Yes, they could change the rotation. What I mean is that it's outside their power to change the personnel. And I don't believe they have a guy right now outside of Andersen who they could give the ball to every play and win consistently. Had they been doing that with Rovig, they would have two more losses in my opinion-- CP and NAU.

It's especially hard to just roll with Rovig right now when Ifanse and Jones are banged up. That means that your backfield most of the time will be Rovig and Perry. That's not getting it done against better teams.

Unless Rovig comes out of the bye much improved, they will be hunting a transfer at QB again in the off-season. I continue to believe that the best version of the Cats in 2019 is the one where Andersen just takes it back over and we become a team that runs the ball, plays good defense, and avoids mistakes.

Good point about the banged-up backs. I concur with your assessment of how we should go. Andersen/jonsen, take care of the ball and grind the clock.

I couldn't disagree with you more on the TA/TJ thing. MSU experienced the ceiling with that type of offense last year. I really don't get the Rovig hate on BN... Rovig alone did not lose this game, I actually thought he played well. He just didn't get enough snaps at Q early on and that's on the coaching staff. This game was lost on a combination of poor defense, poor execution on critical offensive snaps (or poor play calls on said critical snaps) and an overly stubborn offense gameplan. The coaches kept trying to pound it up the middle when it clearly wasn't working. On the first quarter 4th down, TJ kept the ball and got stuffed. Had he handed it to Jones, it appeared to me that it would have been an easy first down, possibly a huge gain. I HATED the gimmick play in the second half where they split the OL and WR out to the wide side of the field. Again, another poor situational play call, a poor decision and even poorer execution by TJ to keep it in that situation.

[msuhunter]

These types of things happen early in the year and can be cleaned up. 6 + games in, they don’t get fixed. That’s just who the Cats are. Call it lack of coaching, lack of discipline/focus on the players, whatever it is if it isn’t fixed by now it ain’t happening

[FTG247365]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

For my armchair coaching ability, why not use our stud HB/TE's more to blow up the holes, some(few) plays we do use them. If we are going to be a run 1st team let's blow up the hole with HB's then use our speed.

[coloradocat]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

I respectfully disagree. Doesn't matter what back is in the backfield with Jonsen. Ninety (or more) percent of the time he will run it up the middle. The way you increase his effectiveness is for him to hand it off more often. Perhaps ala the fly sweep Jones scored on. Also, why keep Rovig on the field when Jonsen or Andersen is in the wild cat formation. So far, every time it's been a run. Take him out and put in another blocker.

I wondered about the Rovig at WR situation too and then figured maybe they leave him in so they don't have to sub anyone and force the defense to adjust with who they have on the field. That only works if you don't sub though and I doubt that's the case every time. I think the key to the Jonsen at QB plan is for him to give the ball up at >25% (not <5%) of the time, whether it's handing it off or throwing a quick pass to Kassis or Rovig (I mean, he is on the field).

[technoCat]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

I respectfully disagree. Doesn't matter what back is in the backfield with Jonsen. Ninety (or more) percent of the time he will run it up the middle. The way you increase his effectiveness is for him to hand it off more often. Perhaps ala the fly sweep Jones scored on. Also, why keep Rovig on the field when Jonsen or Andersen is in the wild cat formation. So far, every time it's been a run. Take him out and put in another blocker.

I wondered about the Rovig at WR situation too and then figured maybe they leave him in so they don't have to sub anyone and force the defense to adjust with who they have on the field. That only works if you don't sub though and I doubt that's the case every time. I think the key to the Jonsen at QB plan is for him to give the ball up at >25% (not <5%) of the time, whether it's handing it off or throwing a quick pass to Kassis or Rovig (I mean, he is on the field).

3 thoughts:
1. The whole point of having Rovig in is not to swap out players and we did it repeatedly in this game. I think MM will learn a lot from that.
2. The cb on Rovig came on a blitz almost 75% of the time I'd wager. Just throw it out there 2 or 3 times to keep the honest. Maybe a double pass?
3. Our RB core is decimated right now. I didn't see KT3 and Ifanse had 2 carries? Did Sumner play offense at all? I think Jones was out again by the end of the game. Makes it hard for Troy and Travis to hand off.

[BleedingBLue]

I care less about the INTs and fumbles than the un-forced errors. Turnovers happen but stupid things like PF penalties, muffed punt snaps and awful punts can't happen.

[RobertoGato]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

I respectfully disagree. Doesn't matter what back is in the backfield with Jonsen. Ninety (or more) percent of the time he will run it up the middle. The way you increase his effectiveness is for him to hand it off more often. Perhaps ala the fly sweep Jones scored on. Also, why keep Rovig on the field when Jonsen or Andersen is in the wild cat formation. So far, every time it's been a run. Take him out and put in another blocker.

You don't think it makes a difference whether you have Ifanse/Jones or Perry? I definitely do.

I believe they keep Rovig on the field so that they don't have to give the defense a chance to substitute, but correct me if I'm wrong.

[84CatGrad]

We had a bad game against a good team. Yet we are 5-2, 2-1 with an off week to heal up and address issues. We're OK. Stay the course. Go 'Cats.

[RobertoGato]

We had a bad game against a good team. Yet we are 5-2, 2-1 with an off week to heal up and address issues. We're OK. Stay the course. Go 'Cats.

I'm not saying the season is over by any stretch of the imagination. But the unforced errors have been a theme this whole season, not just yesterday.

[catscat]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

I respectfully disagree. Doesn't matter what back is in the backfield with Jonsen. Ninety (or more) percent of the time he will run it up the middle. The way you increase his effectiveness is for him to hand it off more often. Perhaps ala the fly sweep Jones scored on. Also, why keep Rovig on the field when Jonsen or Andersen is in the wild cat formation. So far, every time it's been a run. Take him out and put in another blocker.

You don't think it makes a difference whether you have Ifanse/Jones or Perry? I definitely do.

I believe they keep Rovig on the field so that they don't have to give the defense a chance to substitute, but correct me if I'm wrong.

The only way Ifanse/Jones vs Perry or anyone else is if you give them the ball. Jonsen doesn't do that so it makes no difference what back is in the backfield with him.

Yes, I agree that the point of keeping Rovig on the field is to prevent substitution, but how many times do we substitute anyway and even when we don't, it didn't seem to me that Sac St. was phased a bit by not being able to substitute - so the plan wasn't working so you might as well substitute and get another blocker.

[RobertoGato]

I know that the QB rotation is the hot topic right now, but I see something else entirely as being the main problem for the Cats right now-- sloppy football.

SEMO: Cats were rolling in the first quarter when ball security and ST issues let SEMO back in. A fumble deep in MSU's own end gave them a 9 yard TD drive, and a missed 39 yard FG cost us 3 points. So Q1 comes to an end at 10-10, instead of 17-3.

WIU: Tied at 7 to start the second half. You've got Troy Andersen at their 2 yard line and the snap is bad-- 8 yd loss and you have to settle for a FG. 14-7 turns into 10-7 and you have to ask your defense to hold them again.

NAU: After trading some punts, Rovig throws a pick 6 to put them up. Then a fumble around midfield gives them a short TD drive. Instead of being down 7-0 or tied at 7, they're down 21-0.

CP: Close games are pretty typical against a triple option team. But they seemed to be taking control in the 2nd half. But a 6 yard punt gives them one easy score to make it 28-21.Then a pick in their own end gives them another, and you're tied, needing OT to secure the win.

SAC: A bad decision costs us possession on a promising drive. So it's 0-0 instead of 7-0 or 3-0. Then a weird play call on 4th and 1 gives them a short field which they capitalize on. Then a bad punt snap gives them another short field, and they score again. Without the mistakes, the Cats are tied or even up on Sac State instead of being down two touchdowns.

MSU's biggest problem right now is that they're sloppy. Ball security and ST errors are costing them every week. They are good enough to overcome against most FCS teams, but they don't have that margin for error when playing a quality opponent like Sac State. These execution problems need to get cleaned up over the bye. If that's the only thing that improves all season, the Cats will be a much tougher team to beat. And unlike the QB situation, it's actually within their power to address during the season.

Good points. Solid analysis. The qb rotation is within their power to address during the season, it's a matter if whether there is an in-season option that serves the team better than the current arrangement. My personal belief is to roll with a traditional starter, lean on the run game, and sprinkle in the travis/troy stuff. I dislike the lack of flow with the current situation. But, it's debatable whether that change would help or hurt, i get that. I think much of the debate surrounding the topic stems from frustration that we're still having these same conversations 4 years on. Hopefully we're able to get some stability at QB in the near future, because I think it's holding the program back.

Agreed on all points, the offense yesterday was predictable Sac was brought there LBs up inside almost every play so it killed our in run plays for the most part. In the 2nd half we didn't seem to adjust for it.

Every team stacks the box against the Cats, especially when Jonsen or Andersen is under center. And when those guys are taking the snap, the offense is essentially predictable. That was not the problem.

The issue was that we didn't have the running backs to complement the attack. That style of offense depends on legit threats from both men in the backfield. With Ifanse essentially out and Jones limited and then essentially out himself, they didn't have that threat.

So you couple a better run defense with the absence of our best running backs, and the results are what you see yesterday. But even at that, they could have scored a lot more than they did but for execution. Three trips into the red zone resulted in 0 points due to a mixture of poor execution and poor officiating.

I respectfully disagree. Doesn't matter what back is in the backfield with Jonsen. Ninety (or more) percent of the time he will run it up the middle. The way you increase his effectiveness is for him to hand it off more often. Perhaps ala the fly sweep Jones scored on. Also, why keep Rovig on the field when Jonsen or Andersen is in the wild cat formation. So far, every time it's been a run. Take him out and put in another blocker.

You don't think it makes a difference whether you have Ifanse/Jones or Perry? I definitely do.

I believe they keep Rovig on the field so that they don't have to give the defense a chance to substitute, but correct me if I'm wrong.

The only way Ifanse/Jones vs Perry or anyone else is if you give them the ball. Jonsen doesn't do that so it makes no difference what back is in the backfield with him.

Yes, I agree that the point of keeping Rovig on the field is to prevent substitution, but how many times do we substitute anyway and even when we don't, it didn't seem to me that Sac St. was phased a bit by not being able to substitute - so the plan wasn't working so you might as well substitute and get another blocker.

Are you sure about that? Certainly Jonsen keeps the ball a lot, but I seem to remember him handing off to Jones in the first half yesterday. And it was working. But Jones got hurt again.

By preventing substituion, you basically keep defenses in base all the time. If and when Rovig starts playing well, he will find more favorable matchups against base defenses.