2nd half no shows

[cats2506]

I've been to Nebraska and Notre Dame games in the last few years and both have, no reentry policies. 80,000 to 95,000 people and it works for them....I like my beer as good as the next guy (in fact my wife thinks better than the next guy) but it will be the only way to get the seats full for the second half. Beer sales inside the stadium is a no brainier to me.....

Yeah, outside of UM and MSU, I've never seen re-entry policies as liberal as the ones we currently have either. I do think it's important to let people have re-entry for things like running to the car to get something or to warm up in bad weather), and I think that sort of thing could be accomplished with communications to the fans. Basically, if the tailgates were shut down and halftime, but beer was sold in the stadium (along with enough bathrooms, etc.) there would be no motivation to leave the stadium for most people, and we'd have a rowdy house for the whole game. We'd also push a lot more revenue to MSU, which isn't a bad thing.

Obviously, the huge hurdle to get over politically would be the beer in the stadium issue, but it seems like the pendulum is swinging in the right direction on that, and that it may not even be that controversial as time passes. We'd need to have some "no beer" sections for people who don't want to be around it, of course, but little things like that wouldn't be terribly hard to put into place.

On a funny side note, a buddy we know who works with MSU said that someone texted the "help" number Saturday stating they needed beer and gave section, row, and seat number.

I was thinking about texting it saying that we needed new refs

[Joe Bobcat]

If through the years I were to have collected a buck from every fan that has squeezed by me to get to their seat some time in the 3rd quarter all because they couldn't leave their tailgate in time to be back for kickoff I could make a much more substantial contribution to the next stadium expansion. If everyone were to make that collection we could build the thing this coming year.
Everyone that has a tailgate spot buys it because it adds to their game day experience. When the price goes up they pay it because its still worth the money. Everyone that leaves the stadium at half time does so because they see a value in doing so, whether they go to a tailgate or their car or wherever. They get to do that at no $ cost to themselves. They come back into the stadium because they see a value in doing that, again at no $ cost to themselves. We're getting a free ride for something that is so valuable to us. (When you're late coming back there is at least a cost to many others because of the inconvenience of you going by as the game is in progress.)

With how voraciously some defend how important and valuable it is to leave the stadium at half time, it would appear that MSU is sitting on a gold mine and they ought to start profiting from it.
I'm happy to meet halfway on this and let you and myself go out for free and back in free if we make it inside the gates before 3rd quarter kick off. But for those who don't make it back before that then you ought to pay a buck to get back in.

If no reentry was allowed then some would not renew their spot, however someone else would take their place before the door hit their butt on the way out.

[MeerKat]

So you know for sure that this won't change with regards to the stands being full after halftime in the coming years? You're sure that MSU will never sell beer in the stadium?

Well, I'm not sure about that, and I'm not sure how anyone could be sure about that. Obviously lots of other people aren't sure about either of those things, either. So we will probably continue to see people brainstorm and opine on this topic for years to come. Who knows, maybe if enough people opine that they want beer sold in the stadium on this board, that will actually accelerate the process? And maybe, just maybe, the more this is discussed, the more vigilant people will be about getting back to their seats after halftime, even if no changes are made? That would seem like a pretty good result as well, right?

You may want to avoid these threads in the future, though, if you think they are stupid.

Even if they sold beer in the stadium I think you're still going to have people go out and tailgate. Long lines to get an expensive beer or quick run out to my spot to visit with my friends about how the game is going. The tailgating spots are so close I can leave my tailgate spot and be back in my seat in section 113 within 3 minutes. Again I think a notice over the load speaker that bobcat fans have 5 minutes till the second half kickoff would help bring in more people for the kickoff. I sure hope they don't take my halftimes away from me by not letting me go back into the stadium, I pay a premium price for my spot and have since they went on sale. I love being able to visit with my friends who sit 2 sections away about the game. I'm not trying to say i wouldn't like people back in their seats. I'm one who tries to be back by halftime if not before. But I know for me and my friends that running out at halftime is a big part of the experience for us we get a few minutes to discuss, eat, drink and laugh. Just like those who are sitting with friends at home watching on TV holding their favorite beverage.

[CatBlitz]

I've been to Nebraska and Notre Dame games in the last few years and both have, no reentry policies. 80,000 to 95,000 people and it works for them....I like my beer as good as the next guy (in fact my wife thinks better than the next guy) but it will be the only way to get the seats full for the second half. Beer sales inside the stadium is a no brainier to me.....

Yeah, outside of UM and MSU, I've never seen re-entry policies as liberal as the ones we currently have either. I do think it's important to let people have re-entry for things like running to the car to get something or to warm up in bad weather), and I think that sort of thing could be accomplished with communications to the fans. Basically, if the tailgates were shut down and halftime, but beer was sold in the stadium (along with enough bathrooms, etc.) there would be no motivation to leave the stadium for most people, and we'd have a rowdy house for the whole game. We'd also push a lot more revenue to MSU, which isn't a bad thing.

Obviously, the huge hurdle to get over politically would be the beer in the stadium issue, but it seems like the pendulum is swinging in the right direction on that, and that it may not even be that controversial as time passes. We'd need to have some "no beer" sections for people who don't want to be around it, of course, but little things like that wouldn't be terribly hard to put into place.

On a funny side note, a buddy we know who works with MSU said that someone texted the "help" number Saturday stating they needed beer and gave section, row, and seat number.

I was thinking about texting it saying that we needed new refs

Please don't hesitate next time!

[LongTimeCatFan]

LTCF, I don't think the fee for tailgating in any way approaches the money that MSU can make from selling beer. You say that in Lot F there are 59 spaces at $250 per year which means $14,750 to MSU per year. On the other hand, selling a pint of draft beer at $5 will make about $4 for MSU. If they sell 10,000 beers per game, that is a profit of $40,000 per game, times 6 games equals $240,000 per year. Plus, I don't think that everyone who pays for a tailgate spot will discontinue if they can't go out at half time. No body is suggesting an end to tailgating, just the half time flight.

But, like I said, the decision will ultimately be made on one basis, and that is money. Now, I don't believe that beer sales will begin until the east side stands are constructed. The infrastructure is not available on the east side presently. But, I will guarantee you that the infrastructure (heating, cooling, and plumbing) will be included in new construction and beer money will be used to pay the bonds. It is just too much money to continue to pass up.

Yeah, I have no idea how much revenue is generated by the west and east lots. I'm only familiar with the F lot. I do know those spots are 20x20 and cost more.Kmax has an RV spot which I think is 1200 per year.

But you have to at least consider all of the Bobcat licensed products tgat really only get used for tailgating as part of the revenue generation. You also have to consider that a very large number of people that just come for the tailgates and really could care less about the football, yet they still buy a ticket.

You could be right that beer sales at halftime might be too much money to pass up, but they would have to significantly increase the available toilets in order to accomplish the goal of no reentry.

Personally, I'd rather be free to do as I choose and let the beer sales within the stadium be an incentive rather than a compromise to an ultimatum.

[Egg Salad]

On the other hand, selling a pint of draft beer at $5 will make about $4 for MSU.

How do you figure? I googled a few different schools who serve beer at games and all three made less than 50% of each beer sold...

[LongTimeCatFan]

I can see how this is such a polarizing topic for people on both sides of the argument. People watching on tv want to see a full and rowdy stadium, and people at the games want to be able to enjoy the full game experience. This is my two cents and is not intended to influence anyone. I've been a season ticket holder in section 111 for 5 years and own two tailgating spots. The game is still the number one reason why I'm there and I always make it back into the stadium no later then one or two mins after the second half starts. I would love to see the stadium full for the second half but to defend tailgaters (at least the ones on the east side because I don't think the rules apply to the west side) MSU limits the tailgating to two hours before the game the short 20 min at halftime then their kicking you out as soon as the game ends. Now, I spend upwards of a hundred dollars a game between food and drinks and would love to be able to enjoy some more time before and after the game then halftime would not matter as much and I might stay in at half. I'm sure that I'm not the only one who feels this way and im sure there are people that spend way more then I do. Like I said just my two cents thought I would give another perspective.

P.S. This is coming from a full time student working towards their engineering degree while working full time. No, I not rich, my parents are not rich, I am just willing to pay the 2000+ dollars a year to experience bobcat football the way I want to.

I'm pretty sure the rules are 3hours prior to KO and 1 hour after the end of the game. And BAC, you're right about egress. They open Kagy right about the time it's time to go, so we have no problem getting out of there when we leave.

[Catbacker_1]

I can see how this is such a polarizing topic for people on both sides of the argument. People watching on tv want to see a full and rowdy stadium, and people at the games want to be able to enjoy the full game experience. This is my two cents and is not intended to influence anyone. I've been a season ticket holder in section 111 for 5 years and own two tailgating spots. The game is still the number one reason why I'm there and I always make it back into the stadium no later then one or two mins after the second half starts. I would love to see the stadium full for the second half but to defend tailgaters (at least the ones on the east side because I don't think the rules apply to the west side) MSU limits the tailgating to two hours before the game the short 20 min at halftime then their kicking you out as soon as the game ends. Now, I spend upwards of a hundred dollars a game between food and drinks and would love to be able to enjoy some more time before and after the game then halftime would not matter as much and I might stay in at half. I'm sure that I'm not the only one who feels this way and im sure there are people that spend way more then I do. Like I said just my two cents thought I would give another perspective.

P.S. This is coming from a full time student working towards their engineering degree while working full time. No, I not rich, my parents are not rich, I am just willing to pay the 2000+ dollars a year to experience bobcat football the way I want to.

I'm pretty sure the rules are 3hours prior to KO and 1 hour after the end of the game. And BAC, you're right about egress. They open Kagy right about the time it's time to go, so we have no problem getting out of there when we leave.

That's right about the 3 hours before but I have crowd control and campus police telling me I hav to leave 15 min after the game is over

[LongTimeCatFan]

It actually affects most of the alumni and anyone who attends MSU (regardless of whether or they come to games).

Exactly. MSU football games aren't just some semi-pro for-profit sports thing that a few locals attend and nobody else cares about. MSU sports is an integral part of Montana State University, as it is the most high-level marketing aspect of the university (especially with regards to TV coverage) and a key aspect of the student experience. There are a lot of us out here, many of whom don't live close enough to attend many home games who are very involved with all aspects of MSU, and we want to see MSU succeed to the greatest degree possible. We ACTIVELY work toward that goal.

So when we are out here trying to promote MSU to potential students or trying to get more alumni participation/contributions to MSU (and even pitching MSU and Bobcat athletics as a reason for businesses to expand or move to Montana/Bozeman), every bit of positive evidence we can get to show how amazing MSU is helps greatly. So yeah, even something like having an aesthetically pleasing crowd on TV for the second half kickoff (as opposed to the people we are trying to get to be impressed by MSU assuming that nobody goes to MSU games) can be a pretty big deal.

I'm also certain that there is nobody in the MSU world who would disagree with the idea that having a full house for the second half kickoff is a good thing for the success of the MSU football team (again, something that helps all of MSU is a HUGE source of pride to alums around the country), as well as a great thing for the atmosphere of the game itself for fans in attendance, so it makes absolutely no sense for anybody to be excluded from contributing their opinions for the best ways to make that happen.

There's also the not-so-inconsequential aspect of money. It takes a lot of money to do thing like fund the football team operations, scholarships, and stadium expansions. If you want to argue that out-of-state alums don't matter, LTCF, I fully expect that you will be volunteering to step up and fill in the gap of donations to the program that come from the many, many out of state donors.

And, finally, when out of state alums DO have a chance to make it up for football games, we all want to see the most amazing fan experience possible (just like anyone who lives in Montana). And as mentioned, having a full house at the start of the second half (along with beer sold in the stadium and more bathrooms) would be an awesome fan experience.

Again, MSU football is not some cracker jack locals-only operation. It is a program of nationwide importance, nationwide TV reach, nationwide fan base, and nationwide revenue base.

I just noticed this post.

And it all comes crumbling down if people quit coming. Look no further than our Basketball program. So it's all still dependent on butts in seats and tailgaters in the lots. Without them, what's the point?

You make some valid points about out of state boosters, but don't pretend that their voice supersedes the voice of the regular die hards. I do agree though, we need both to have a very successful program.

I just don't appreciate the notion that those people would dictate policy which may or may not hinder the trajectory of growth of the program (butts in seats). IE when someone who doesn't attend the games thinks they have a better notion than those that do about how the gameday experience should be run.

Personally, I think in the grand scheme of all that you are talking about, 5 minutes of the 3rd qtr with a partially full stadium seems pretty insignificant.

If you cut out half time re-entry don't be surprised to see attendance drop to under 15k to start the game and under 7k to start the half, especially in September or if we're losing.

[LongTimeCatFan]

I can see how this is such a polarizing topic for people on both sides of the argument. People watching on tv want to see a full and rowdy stadium, and people at the games want to be able to enjoy the full game experience. This is my two cents and is not intended to influence anyone. I've been a season ticket holder in section 111 for 5 years and own two tailgating spots. The game is still the number one reason why I'm there and I always make it back into the stadium no later then one or two mins after the second half starts. I would love to see the stadium full for the second half but to defend tailgaters (at least the ones on the east side because I don't think the rules apply to the west side) MSU limits the tailgating to two hours before the game the short 20 min at halftime then their kicking you out as soon as the game ends. Now, I spend upwards of a hundred dollars a game between food and drinks and would love to be able to enjoy some more time before and after the game then halftime would not matter as much and I might stay in at half. I'm sure that I'm not the only one who feels this way and im sure there are people that spend way more then I do. Like I said just my two cents thought I would give another perspective.

P.S. This is coming from a full time student working towards their engineering degree while working full time. No, I not rich, my parents are not rich, I am just willing to pay the 2000+ dollars a year to experience bobcat football the way I want to.

I'm pretty sure the rules are 3hours prior to KO and 1 hour after the end of the game. And BAC, you're right about egress. They open Kagy right about the time it's time to go, so we have no problem getting out of there when we leave.

That's right about the 3 hours before but I have crowd control and campus police telling me I hav to leave 15 min after the game is over

I'll see if I can find the rules online so you can print them and then tell the police to back off.
http://www.msubobcats.com/documents/201 ... .pdf?path=

Yes, you have an hour to pack it up.

[SonomaCat]

You make some valid points about out of state boosters, but don't pretend that their voice supersedes the voice of the regular die hards.

Don't pretend like I said they did.

[LongTimeCatFan]

You make some valid points about out of state boosters, but don't pretend that their voice supersedes the voice of the regular die hards.

Don't pretend like I said they did.

Did you not make that insinuation?

[PapaG]

If BAC gets involved in a thread, you know it's going to go completely sideways. I think we're at about 40k elevation with this launch.

Anyhow. If people who paid money for their tickets didn't want to get to their seats for the start of the second half, why should any of us care?

[SonomaCat]

You make some valid points about out of state boosters, but don't pretend that their voice supersedes the voice of the regular die hards.

Don't pretend like I said they did.

Did you not make that insinuation?

Nope, not even close. And anybody who cares can read what I actually wrote. I have no interest in going down a rathole with you on this and wasting a bunch of time to debate something obvious, so just stick to expressing your own opinions. I already expressed my opinions as much as I care to, and anybody who wants to know my opinions can rely on what I actually wrote.

[LongTimeCatFan]

You make some valid points about out of state boosters, but don't pretend that their voice supersedes the voice of the regular die hards.

Don't pretend like I said they did.

Did you not make that insinuation?

Nope, not even close. And anybody who cares can read what I actually wrote. I have no interest in going down a rathole with you on this and wasting a bunch of time to debate something obvious, so just stick to expressing your own opinions. I already expressed my opinions as much as I care to, and anybody who wants to know my opinions can rely on what I actually wrote.

Ok fair enough. I really don't care to do a semantics BS back and forth either.

[ilovethecats]

If BAC gets involved in a thread, you know it's going to go completely sideways. I think we're at about 40k elevation with this launch.

Anyhow. If people who paid money for their tickets didn't want to get to their seats for the start of the second half, why should any of us care?

that's always been my take to PG. sure, in a perfect world we'd have 25,000 loud, screaming, rabid fans in the stadium and hour before kickoff, during every single down throughout the game, and remain there until the last bobcat coach, player and staff walks off the field and through the tunnel. every person in the stands would stand up and scream all game long. people would love the band, love the smoke entering the field from burgers cooking below, love how loud and cold it is, love all the promotions, love all the advertisements, etc. and the student section would actually not suck.

but this isn't the case. people pay money to attend a game. they are going to enjoy in in whatever manner they please. if that means not making it back to their seat until after the 3rd quarter has started so be it. if that means leaving early in the the 2nd quarter to go slam a few beers and talk about the half more power to them. i don't see why this bothers people so much. especially when it doesn't seem to bother the players and coaches that much. at least not those that i have talked to. or the former players that frequent the same tailgate that i do that also enjoy beers at half and are often a few minutes late back in. hell, i can think of 3 all americans and bobcat hall of famers that are often a few minutes late getting back to their seat in the 3rd. if it's good enough for them and a moot point...then i don't see it as a real big issue.

[[cat_bracket]]

If BAC gets involved in a thread, you know it's going to go completely sideways. I think we're at about 40k elevation with this launch.

Anyhow. If people who paid money for their tickets didn't want to get to their seats for the start of the second half, why should any of us care?

that's always been my take to PG. sure, in a perfect world we'd have 25,000 loud, screaming, rabid fans in the stadium and hour before kickoff, during every single down throughout the game, and remain there until the last bobcat coach, player and staff walks off the field and through the tunnel. every person in the stands would stand up and scream all game long. people would love the band, love the smoke entering the field from burgers cooking below, love how loud and cold it is, love all the promotions, love all the advertisements, etc. and the student section would actually not suck.

but this isn't the case. people pay money to attend a game. they are going to enjoy in in whatever manner they please. if that means not making it back to their seat until after the 3rd quarter has started so be it. if that means leaving early in the the 2nd quarter to go slam a few beers and talk about the half more power to them. i don't see why this bothers people so much. especially when it doesn't seem to bother the players and coaches that much. at least not those that i have talked to. or the former players that frequent the same tailgate that i do that also enjoy beers at half and are often a few minutes late back in. hell, i can think of 3 all americans and bobcat hall of famers that are often a few minutes late getting back to their seat in the 3rd. if it's good enough for them and a moot point...then i don't see it as a real big issue.

You're right. The players don't get bummed out that half the fans are gone to start the third quarter, I have to think that they would get a boost if most were back and loud. So it boils down to fans making that choice. Do I want to give the team a boost or not?

[CelticCat]

You bought the ticket, you paid good money for it, do want you want with it.

Ideally it would be awesome to have everyone back in their seats, but you just can't force people to do something like that. I was always ready to go because I paid good money for my ticket and I wasn't going to miss a minute of the game, but I understand not everyone is there just to watch football like most of us.

I agree, I don't see why this is such a big deal and why people get so upset about it?

[LongTimeCatFan]

If BAC gets involved in a thread, you know it's going to go completely sideways. I think we're at about 40k elevation with this launch.

Anyhow. If people who paid money for their tickets didn't want to get to their seats for the start of the second half, why should any of us care?

that's always been my take to PG. sure, in a perfect world we'd have 25,000 loud, screaming, rabid fans in the stadium and hour before kickoff, during every single down throughout the game, and remain there until the last bobcat coach, player and staff walks off the field and through the tunnel. every person in the stands would stand up and scream all game long. people would love the band, love the smoke entering the field from burgers cooking below, love how loud and cold it is, love all the promotions, love all the advertisements, etc. and the student section would actually not suck.

but this isn't the case. people pay money to attend a game. they are going to enjoy in in whatever manner they please. if that means not making it back to their seat until after the 3rd quarter has started so be it. if that means leaving early in the the 2nd quarter to go slam a few beers and talk about the half more power to them. i don't see why this bothers people so much. especially when it doesn't seem to bother the players and coaches that much. at least not those that i have talked to. or the former players that frequent the same tailgate that i do that also enjoy beers at half and are often a few minutes late back in. hell, i can think of 3 all americans and bobcat hall of famers that are often a few minutes late getting back to their seat in the 3rd. if it's good enough for them and a moot point...then i don't see it as a real big issue.

Excellent

I was thinking about this more today. So the issue for the folks watching on TV is that they have to look at empty stands. Most people are peeing at halftime. What difference does it make to those at home whether we pee in the stadium or outside by the tailgate where we can grab a drink to help our throats that have just been thrashed from all of the yelling?

The point being is I think the stands would be pretty empty at halftime regardless of any proposed re-entry restriction.

[SonomaCat]

Just to clarify ... any comments about how it looks on TV have been in reference to the second half kickoff and the third quarter. Obviously the stands would thin out during halftime no matter what policies were in place.